Corruption of 'English' as she is spoke
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I just read one of the entries in Raymond Chens' excellent 'The Old New Thing' blog. I was directed there from a thread in the C# forum and it has been some time since I last read any of them although I used to do so quite frequently. If this was there on my previous visits I never noticed it. In the header I noticed this:
not actually to establish a blogging point where individuals can enrich their learns on facilitating and leveraging .NET-related activities most effectively
Now, in fairness, the phrase is set up as a link, the content of which explains how it came to be worded as it is. So I guess that it is tongue in cheek but if I were not aware of the excellence of his writings and I noticed this on my first ever opening of one of the articles I might well have moved on without reading further. As one of the comments to the linked article says:
On the plus side, you know just from the first page of the site that it won't contain anything of value.
Are there any sites that have turned you off, simply because of a phrase in the first few lines, rather than eye-bleedingly bad design?
Henry Minute Do not read medical books! You could die of a misprint. - Mark Twain Girl: (staring) "Why do you need an icy cucumber?" “I want to report a fraud. The government is lying to us all.”
For me its not just sites, but also Books, Adverts (ie, Posters/Flyers/Banners, etc) and etc. If I come across GLARING mis-use of Her Majesties English, I tend to just disregard whatever it is that I'm being exposed to (despite my own slight disability with proper grammar). I even find the use of 'color' over 'colour' somewhat grating; alas, I have had to learn to live with that one (primarily because EVERY programming language I can think of goes there!). Other pet hates: * 'One Time' - "I saw this guy at the shops, ONE TIME..." * 'then/than' - "12 is bigger THEN 10." * 'I was Like' - "And I was like, 'Oh My God'..." * 'Defense' - Its actually DEFENCE * 'Aluminum' - what happened to the 'i'?? ALUMINIUM * and of course the pronunciation of abbreviation like LOL ('loll') or ROFLMAO (Roffel-mao) Jesus Christ, even the spell-checker here at Uni is against me! It actually recognises LOL and ROFLMAO, while telling me that 'recognise' is wrong! - now I'm annoyed, so I will stop here. I completely understand that all Language is in a constant state of evolution; this evolution is typically the result of interacting with other languages/cultures and the need to increase the level of clarity within communication. While the changes in spelling are understandable (even if I do not approve) my problem is that the more recent evolutions in 'bastardised English' are introducing ambiguity into the language (eg, 'You aint got shit coming' does that mean I'm not getting shit or I am getting shit? Or 'This is better THEN that' - if that like an If-Then condition or are they just saying then when they mean THAN?). But at the end of the day, its language and culture - so its a case of adapt or die!
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For me its not just sites, but also Books, Adverts (ie, Posters/Flyers/Banners, etc) and etc. If I come across GLARING mis-use of Her Majesties English, I tend to just disregard whatever it is that I'm being exposed to (despite my own slight disability with proper grammar). I even find the use of 'color' over 'colour' somewhat grating; alas, I have had to learn to live with that one (primarily because EVERY programming language I can think of goes there!). Other pet hates: * 'One Time' - "I saw this guy at the shops, ONE TIME..." * 'then/than' - "12 is bigger THEN 10." * 'I was Like' - "And I was like, 'Oh My God'..." * 'Defense' - Its actually DEFENCE * 'Aluminum' - what happened to the 'i'?? ALUMINIUM * and of course the pronunciation of abbreviation like LOL ('loll') or ROFLMAO (Roffel-mao) Jesus Christ, even the spell-checker here at Uni is against me! It actually recognises LOL and ROFLMAO, while telling me that 'recognise' is wrong! - now I'm annoyed, so I will stop here. I completely understand that all Language is in a constant state of evolution; this evolution is typically the result of interacting with other languages/cultures and the need to increase the level of clarity within communication. While the changes in spelling are understandable (even if I do not approve) my problem is that the more recent evolutions in 'bastardised English' are introducing ambiguity into the language (eg, 'You aint got shit coming' does that mean I'm not getting shit or I am getting shit? Or 'This is better THEN that' - if that like an If-Then condition or are they just saying then when they mean THAN?). But at the end of the day, its language and culture - so its a case of adapt or die!
MrZaggy wrote:
For me it's not just sites, but also books, adverts (ie, posters/flyers/banners, etc) and etc. If I come across GLARING misuse of Her Majesty's English, I tend to just disregard whatever it is that I'm being exposed to
Sorry, couldn't resist. :-) I ignore these things if it's just in a casual email or an instant message from someone I know, but if it's at the top of a website or, even more annoyingly, in a newspaper, I stop looking at it pretty quickly.
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For me its not just sites, but also Books, Adverts (ie, Posters/Flyers/Banners, etc) and etc. If I come across GLARING mis-use of Her Majesties English, I tend to just disregard whatever it is that I'm being exposed to (despite my own slight disability with proper grammar). I even find the use of 'color' over 'colour' somewhat grating; alas, I have had to learn to live with that one (primarily because EVERY programming language I can think of goes there!). Other pet hates: * 'One Time' - "I saw this guy at the shops, ONE TIME..." * 'then/than' - "12 is bigger THEN 10." * 'I was Like' - "And I was like, 'Oh My God'..." * 'Defense' - Its actually DEFENCE * 'Aluminum' - what happened to the 'i'?? ALUMINIUM * and of course the pronunciation of abbreviation like LOL ('loll') or ROFLMAO (Roffel-mao) Jesus Christ, even the spell-checker here at Uni is against me! It actually recognises LOL and ROFLMAO, while telling me that 'recognise' is wrong! - now I'm annoyed, so I will stop here. I completely understand that all Language is in a constant state of evolution; this evolution is typically the result of interacting with other languages/cultures and the need to increase the level of clarity within communication. While the changes in spelling are understandable (even if I do not approve) my problem is that the more recent evolutions in 'bastardised English' are introducing ambiguity into the language (eg, 'You aint got shit coming' does that mean I'm not getting shit or I am getting shit? Or 'This is better THEN that' - if that like an If-Then condition or are they just saying then when they mean THAN?). But at the end of the day, its language and culture - so its a case of adapt or die!
MrZaggy wrote:
* 'One Time' - "I saw this guy at the shops, ONE TIME..."
It's a natural (if unnecessary) extension of "two times". I'll agree it can be a niggle, but funnily enough, "the one time, I was doing..." isn't.
MrZaggy wrote:
* 'then/than' - "12 is bigger THEN 10."
I don't recall having seen a native speaker make that mistake, but it confuses the Hell out of the poor ESL foreigners who have to learn our awful language.
MrZaggy wrote:
* 'I was Like' - "And I was like, 'Oh My God'..."
A group idiom is only for the group that uses it. If you ain't in that group (and we ain't), you'll probably hate it.
MrZaggy wrote:
* 'Defense' - Its actually DEFENCE
Of course it is. It's also defense. Both spellings are perfectly acceptable.
MrZaggy wrote:
* 'Aluminum' - what happened to the 'i'?? ALUMINIUM
They are two different things.
MrZaggy wrote:
* and of course the pronunciation of abbreviation like LOL ('loll') or ROFLMAO (Roffel-mao)
That's how a lot of words are created. Or do you think that we should say "read-only memory" every time we talk about ROM? However, language peeves are the most personal thing in the world (and the things that annoy me about English usage do so for no more rational reasons than those that annoy others), so you're allowed to "hate" any usage you want to. Just don't expect everyone else to share your tastes.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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MrZaggy wrote:
For me it's not just sites, but also books, adverts (ie, posters/flyers/banners, etc) and etc. If I come across GLARING misuse of Her Majesty's English, I tend to just disregard whatever it is that I'm being exposed to
Sorry, couldn't resist. :-) I ignore these things if it's just in a casual email or an instant message from someone I know, but if it's at the top of a website or, even more annoyingly, in a newspaper, I stop looking at it pretty quickly.
Haha, damn! You beat me to it! I was like, totally just about to do that. :laugh:
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MrZaggy wrote:
* 'One Time' - "I saw this guy at the shops, ONE TIME..."
It's a natural (if unnecessary) extension of "two times". I'll agree it can be a niggle, but funnily enough, "the one time, I was doing..." isn't.
MrZaggy wrote:
* 'then/than' - "12 is bigger THEN 10."
I don't recall having seen a native speaker make that mistake, but it confuses the Hell out of the poor ESL foreigners who have to learn our awful language.
MrZaggy wrote:
* 'I was Like' - "And I was like, 'Oh My God'..."
A group idiom is only for the group that uses it. If you ain't in that group (and we ain't), you'll probably hate it.
MrZaggy wrote:
* 'Defense' - Its actually DEFENCE
Of course it is. It's also defense. Both spellings are perfectly acceptable.
MrZaggy wrote:
* 'Aluminum' - what happened to the 'i'?? ALUMINIUM
They are two different things.
MrZaggy wrote:
* and of course the pronunciation of abbreviation like LOL ('loll') or ROFLMAO (Roffel-mao)
That's how a lot of words are created. Or do you think that we should say "read-only memory" every time we talk about ROM? However, language peeves are the most personal thing in the world (and the things that annoy me about English usage do so for no more rational reasons than those that annoy others), so you're allowed to "hate" any usage you want to. Just don't expect everyone else to share your tastes.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
'then/than' - "12 is bigger THEN 10." (:mad:) "I don't recall having seen a native speaker make that mistake" ( :laugh: ) You're joking, right? Then/than, here/hear, your/you're, there/their/they're, "I would of" vs. "I would have" and misuse of possessive apostrophes are my biggest pet hates, and it is very surprising, irrespective of age, how many people just have no clue whatsoever about these things. I correct people's ineffective use of English way too often. A self-certified grammar Nazi, that's me :) I don't understand how people can simply not care about incorrect spellings, conjugations or poor use of grammar. It drives me nuts, but most people couldn't care less. Another thing we can blame on Microsoft - spell-checker. :laugh:
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'then/than' - "12 is bigger THEN 10." (:mad:) "I don't recall having seen a native speaker make that mistake" ( :laugh: ) You're joking, right? Then/than, here/hear, your/you're, there/their/they're, "I would of" vs. "I would have" and misuse of possessive apostrophes are my biggest pet hates, and it is very surprising, irrespective of age, how many people just have no clue whatsoever about these things. I correct people's ineffective use of English way too often. A self-certified grammar Nazi, that's me :) I don't understand how people can simply not care about incorrect spellings, conjugations or poor use of grammar. It drives me nuts, but most people couldn't care less. Another thing we can blame on Microsoft - spell-checker. :laugh:
I had a mate at Uni, here in Sweden, a totally native Swede, who spent a couple of school years in the US somewhere around the age of 16-17. He excelled at English/American grammar compared to his native class mates in the US. He got the best grades in his class in all language related areas during his two years there. "They really, really, had no clue." His words.
-- Time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time - Bertrand Russel
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I had a mate at Uni, here in Sweden, a totally native Swede, who spent a couple of school years in the US somewhere around the age of 16-17. He excelled at English/American grammar compared to his native class mates in the US. He got the best grades in his class in all language related areas during his two years there. "They really, really, had no clue." His words.
-- Time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time - Bertrand Russel
If you ask him, he'll probably tell you that his Swedish was awful, until he started seriously studying English. It usually works that way. When people ask me for general help on improving their English grammar, I tell them to learn Italian.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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'then/than' - "12 is bigger THEN 10." (:mad:) "I don't recall having seen a native speaker make that mistake" ( :laugh: ) You're joking, right? Then/than, here/hear, your/you're, there/their/they're, "I would of" vs. "I would have" and misuse of possessive apostrophes are my biggest pet hates, and it is very surprising, irrespective of age, how many people just have no clue whatsoever about these things. I correct people's ineffective use of English way too often. A self-certified grammar Nazi, that's me :) I don't understand how people can simply not care about incorrect spellings, conjugations or poor use of grammar. It drives me nuts, but most people couldn't care less. Another thing we can blame on Microsoft - spell-checker. :laugh:
NickHighIQ wrote:
here/hear, your/you're, there/their/they're, "I would of" vs. "I would have" and misuse of possessive apostrophes
I've noted all of those a metaphorical million times. Maybe I'm just blindspotting the then/than thing.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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If you ask him, he'll probably tell you that his Swedish was awful, until he started seriously studying English. It usually works that way. When people ask me for general help on improving their English grammar, I tell them to learn Italian.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
Mark Wallace wrote:
he'll probably tell you that his Swedish was awful, until he started seriously studying English
:) I bet he wouldn't say that. His Swedish was perfect. As the language itself, of course... ;) And no, it's nowhere near the jibberish that flows out of the Swedish chef[^] ...
-- Time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time - Bertrand Russel
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Mark Wallace wrote:
he'll probably tell you that his Swedish was awful, until he started seriously studying English
:) I bet he wouldn't say that. His Swedish was perfect. As the language itself, of course... ;) And no, it's nowhere near the jibberish that flows out of the Swedish chef[^] ...
-- Time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time - Bertrand Russel
Johann Gerell wrote:
And no, it's nowhere near the jibberish that flows out of the Swedish chef[^] ...
??? You mean that's not real Swedish!?! Another fantasy destroyed...
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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Mark Wallace wrote:
he'll probably tell you that his Swedish was awful, until he started seriously studying English
:) I bet he wouldn't say that. His Swedish was perfect. As the language itself, of course... ;) And no, it's nowhere near the jibberish that flows out of the Swedish chef[^] ...
-- Time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time - Bertrand Russel
Johann Gerell wrote:
Time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time - Bertrand Russel
Damn! I've been trying to remember who said that for weeks!
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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I just read one of the entries in Raymond Chens' excellent 'The Old New Thing' blog. I was directed there from a thread in the C# forum and it has been some time since I last read any of them although I used to do so quite frequently. If this was there on my previous visits I never noticed it. In the header I noticed this:
not actually to establish a blogging point where individuals can enrich their learns on facilitating and leveraging .NET-related activities most effectively
Now, in fairness, the phrase is set up as a link, the content of which explains how it came to be worded as it is. So I guess that it is tongue in cheek but if I were not aware of the excellence of his writings and I noticed this on my first ever opening of one of the articles I might well have moved on without reading further. As one of the comments to the linked article says:
On the plus side, you know just from the first page of the site that it won't contain anything of value.
Are there any sites that have turned you off, simply because of a phrase in the first few lines, rather than eye-bleedingly bad design?
Henry Minute Do not read medical books! You could die of a misprint. - Mark Twain Girl: (staring) "Why do you need an icy cucumber?" “I want to report a fraud. The government is lying to us all.”
I am a Canadian in Ireland and in all the sports and evening news reports from both Ireland and the UK I keep hearing a particual phrase that drives me insane. In sports the phrsae is typically: "this games is really hotting up" or In news: "the debate hotted up" This is from well educated national and private broadcasters... But when I, tongue in cheak, say "this game is colding down" they look at me as though I have too heads. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- P.S: If you are confused by this post, the correct term is "heating up" and "cooling down" :(
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I just read one of the entries in Raymond Chens' excellent 'The Old New Thing' blog. I was directed there from a thread in the C# forum and it has been some time since I last read any of them although I used to do so quite frequently. If this was there on my previous visits I never noticed it. In the header I noticed this:
not actually to establish a blogging point where individuals can enrich their learns on facilitating and leveraging .NET-related activities most effectively
Now, in fairness, the phrase is set up as a link, the content of which explains how it came to be worded as it is. So I guess that it is tongue in cheek but if I were not aware of the excellence of his writings and I noticed this on my first ever opening of one of the articles I might well have moved on without reading further. As one of the comments to the linked article says:
On the plus side, you know just from the first page of the site that it won't contain anything of value.
Are there any sites that have turned you off, simply because of a phrase in the first few lines, rather than eye-bleedingly bad design?
Henry Minute Do not read medical books! You could die of a misprint. - Mark Twain Girl: (staring) "Why do you need an icy cucumber?" “I want to report a fraud. The government is lying to us all.”
Henry Minute wrote:
Are there any sites that have turned you off, simply because of a phrase in the first few lines, rather than eye-bleedingly bad design?
It's not just bad phrases; the use of wrongly placed punctuation can be just as bad. It seems to me that the most difficult piece of punctuation that the majority of English speaking people do not understand is how to use the humble apostrophe. Not even my daughter's teachers know how to use it. There is simply no hope for the English speaking world that does not understand where to correctly put an apostrophe in a sentance. I wouldn't mind if the rules of use were difficult, but they're not. See these examples: http://www.apostrophe.org.uk/examples_1.htm[^]
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I am a Canadian in Ireland and in all the sports and evening news reports from both Ireland and the UK I keep hearing a particual phrase that drives me insane. In sports the phrsae is typically: "this games is really hotting up" or In news: "the debate hotted up" This is from well educated national and private broadcasters... But when I, tongue in cheak, say "this game is colding down" they look at me as though I have too heads. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- P.S: If you are confused by this post, the correct term is "heating up" and "cooling down" :(
"they look at me as though I have too heads." Oh dear! ;P
Vincent www.pub-olympics.com
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For me its not just sites, but also Books, Adverts (ie, Posters/Flyers/Banners, etc) and etc. If I come across GLARING mis-use of Her Majesties English, I tend to just disregard whatever it is that I'm being exposed to (despite my own slight disability with proper grammar). I even find the use of 'color' over 'colour' somewhat grating; alas, I have had to learn to live with that one (primarily because EVERY programming language I can think of goes there!). Other pet hates: * 'One Time' - "I saw this guy at the shops, ONE TIME..." * 'then/than' - "12 is bigger THEN 10." * 'I was Like' - "And I was like, 'Oh My God'..." * 'Defense' - Its actually DEFENCE * 'Aluminum' - what happened to the 'i'?? ALUMINIUM * and of course the pronunciation of abbreviation like LOL ('loll') or ROFLMAO (Roffel-mao) Jesus Christ, even the spell-checker here at Uni is against me! It actually recognises LOL and ROFLMAO, while telling me that 'recognise' is wrong! - now I'm annoyed, so I will stop here. I completely understand that all Language is in a constant state of evolution; this evolution is typically the result of interacting with other languages/cultures and the need to increase the level of clarity within communication. While the changes in spelling are understandable (even if I do not approve) my problem is that the more recent evolutions in 'bastardised English' are introducing ambiguity into the language (eg, 'You aint got shit coming' does that mean I'm not getting shit or I am getting shit? Or 'This is better THEN that' - if that like an If-Then condition or are they just saying then when they mean THAN?). But at the end of the day, its language and culture - so its a case of adapt or die!
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Henry Minute wrote:
Are there any sites that have turned you off, simply because of a phrase in the first few lines, rather than eye-bleedingly bad design?
...an integrated suite of server capabilities that can help improve organizational effectiveness by providing comprehensive content management and enterprise search, accelerating shared business processes, and facilitating information-sharing across boundaries for better business insight.
... they have even repeated the same statements from the previous version of the same application ...
Reuse! Buy If You Can! Build If You Must
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I just read one of the entries in Raymond Chens' excellent 'The Old New Thing' blog. I was directed there from a thread in the C# forum and it has been some time since I last read any of them although I used to do so quite frequently. If this was there on my previous visits I never noticed it. In the header I noticed this:
not actually to establish a blogging point where individuals can enrich their learns on facilitating and leveraging .NET-related activities most effectively
Now, in fairness, the phrase is set up as a link, the content of which explains how it came to be worded as it is. So I guess that it is tongue in cheek but if I were not aware of the excellence of his writings and I noticed this on my first ever opening of one of the articles I might well have moved on without reading further. As one of the comments to the linked article says:
On the plus side, you know just from the first page of the site that it won't contain anything of value.
Are there any sites that have turned you off, simply because of a phrase in the first few lines, rather than eye-bleedingly bad design?
Henry Minute Do not read medical books! You could die of a misprint. - Mark Twain Girl: (staring) "Why do you need an icy cucumber?" “I want to report a fraud. The government is lying to us all.”
One thing that bugs me and that I have seen come up more and more frequently is the use of a plural verb when referring to a singular entity, such as a corporation. This seems to be an Australian thing (especially prevalent on the Sitepoint.com site), but it's apparently spreading. For example, "Microsoft are going to ..." or "Google have ..." rather than "Microsoft is going to ..." or "Google has..." Strangely enough, these writers will treat certain corporate names as plural, but others as singular. I often see in the same sentence something to the effect of "Microsoft have... while Google has..."
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For me its not just sites, but also Books, Adverts (ie, Posters/Flyers/Banners, etc) and etc. If I come across GLARING mis-use of Her Majesties English, I tend to just disregard whatever it is that I'm being exposed to (despite my own slight disability with proper grammar). I even find the use of 'color' over 'colour' somewhat grating; alas, I have had to learn to live with that one (primarily because EVERY programming language I can think of goes there!). Other pet hates: * 'One Time' - "I saw this guy at the shops, ONE TIME..." * 'then/than' - "12 is bigger THEN 10." * 'I was Like' - "And I was like, 'Oh My God'..." * 'Defense' - Its actually DEFENCE * 'Aluminum' - what happened to the 'i'?? ALUMINIUM * and of course the pronunciation of abbreviation like LOL ('loll') or ROFLMAO (Roffel-mao) Jesus Christ, even the spell-checker here at Uni is against me! It actually recognises LOL and ROFLMAO, while telling me that 'recognise' is wrong! - now I'm annoyed, so I will stop here. I completely understand that all Language is in a constant state of evolution; this evolution is typically the result of interacting with other languages/cultures and the need to increase the level of clarity within communication. While the changes in spelling are understandable (even if I do not approve) my problem is that the more recent evolutions in 'bastardised English' are introducing ambiguity into the language (eg, 'You aint got shit coming' does that mean I'm not getting shit or I am getting shit? Or 'This is better THEN that' - if that like an If-Then condition or are they just saying then when they mean THAN?). But at the end of the day, its language and culture - so its a case of adapt or die!
There are two new phrases here in the states that drive me crazy, ready for this? "These ones" If you are at a store looking for a product, the sales person may say "How about these ones?" It either has to be "This one" or "Theses", ugh it drives me crazy! Now for number two, sorry but I really don't know how to spell it. "Yous guys'", pronounced; Yous guyses. Every time I go to a restaurant, the waiter or waitress will say, "Hi, I will be yous guyses server". Are we deliberately trying to destroy the English language?
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I just read one of the entries in Raymond Chens' excellent 'The Old New Thing' blog. I was directed there from a thread in the C# forum and it has been some time since I last read any of them although I used to do so quite frequently. If this was there on my previous visits I never noticed it. In the header I noticed this:
not actually to establish a blogging point where individuals can enrich their learns on facilitating and leveraging .NET-related activities most effectively
Now, in fairness, the phrase is set up as a link, the content of which explains how it came to be worded as it is. So I guess that it is tongue in cheek but if I were not aware of the excellence of his writings and I noticed this on my first ever opening of one of the articles I might well have moved on without reading further. As one of the comments to the linked article says:
On the plus side, you know just from the first page of the site that it won't contain anything of value.
Are there any sites that have turned you off, simply because of a phrase in the first few lines, rather than eye-bleedingly bad design?
Henry Minute Do not read medical books! You could die of a misprint. - Mark Twain Girl: (staring) "Why do you need an icy cucumber?" “I want to report a fraud. The government is lying to us all.”
An expression that has been bugging me of late: "I could care less" As far as i am aware the phrase should read "I Couldn't care less", thus suggesting that you care so little that it would not be possible to reduce the amount you care any further. To say "I Could care less" means the amount you care is somewhere in the range 0 < x <= Max So, therefore, it encompasses REALLY caring all the way to do comparing a negligible amount whilst NEVER meaning "I don't care" as is intended