So in SCRUM...?
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Chris Losinger wrote:
ruthlessly prioritizing everything
Chris Losinger wrote:
if development screws that up, and makes the sales team look bad, then development is going to be in a world of sh*t.
This started from day one (2 weeks ago). Delivery date is 6 months out
kmg365 wrote:
This started from day one (2 weeks ago). Delivery date is 6 months out
well, there's always some planning at the start, just to get a rough idea as to what can reasonably make it into the release - estimates etc.. but it usually stops once marketing, sales & dev agree on what features need to be in the release. and that all happens before the cycle starts, ideally. once things get moving, talk of the schedule only happens when something really extraordinary comes up which will definitely affect the deadline - or when the release date gets close. i'd be a little worried, frankly, if any manager (or developer) was constantly nervous about the schedule six months out. again, that's my experience. every place does things a little differently, though. no two managers are alike...
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Is it normal to have daily meetings lasting 1/2 hour, every issue being analyzed as to it's impact on the schedule. It's not pleasant and is in fact odd and seems to encourage hostilities. My first SCRUM project I worked on. Was just wondering?
It sounds like they're using SCRUM for the wrong reasons. One place I was at it was an excuse to void organisng and acting like a laod of merchant bankers compelte with red braces. Yes, there is a euphemism in there as well.
Join the cool kids - Come fold with us[^]
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Is it normal to have daily meetings lasting 1/2 hour, every issue being analyzed as to it's impact on the schedule. It's not pleasant and is in fact odd and seems to encourage hostilities. My first SCRUM project I worked on. Was just wondering?
kmg365 wrote:
Is it normal to have daily meetings lasting 1/2 hour
Meeting length has less to do with the product and the methods than the people. Talk to me when you've survived a two hour session of "You broke ... Jeff, fix it." Our longest meeting was 4.5 hours I think... I've lost track there have been soooooo many and they all ended up being complete wastes of time and just power-plays. The caller of those meetings now owns his own business. :-D
_________________________ John Andrew Holmes "It is well to remember that the entire universe, with one trifling exception, is composed of others." Shhhhh.... I am not really here. I am a figment of your imagination.... I am still in my cave so this must be an illusion....
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Is it normal to have daily meetings lasting 1/2 hour, every issue being analyzed as to it's impact on the schedule. It's not pleasant and is in fact odd and seems to encourage hostilities. My first SCRUM project I worked on. Was just wondering?
kmg365 wrote:
My first SCRUM project I worked on. Was just wondering?
from one of many SCRUM sources, I tried to convince others that this is how it should be... but with one meeting lasting 2 hours we never had more than one a week and sometimes we couldn't stomach that. Anyhow... try these rules on for a spin:
Before You Scrum Before holding your first scrum, your team – with the help of management – must decide what projects should be completed in the next 15 to 30 days – a time period known as the sprint. At the end of the sprint, your team is expected to have completed all assigned work. Also, it's important to remind managers that their job is not to tell the team members how to do their work, explains Schwaber, but instead to be their coach and help them succeed. Rules for Scrum Meetings * Choose a scrum leader to enforce the rules during the sprint * Hold scrums every day in the same location and at the same time - preferably first thing in the morning * Each scrum should last only 15 to 30 minutes * Ask all participants the same three questions: What did you do since the last scrum? What are you going to do between now and the next scrum? Is anything in the way of you doing your work? * Address issues other than the three questions outside the scrum – this includes suggestions for a team member who's hit a roadblock * Managers are not allowed to speak * If a manager or colleague assigns unplanned work to a team member that will throw the team's schedule off track, the scrum leader has the power to excuse the person of the additional work. The work must either be fit into the next sprint or be assigned to someone who's not on the team. * Your team must have a concrete deliverable for management after the sprint * Start the process again after each sprint
_________________________ John Andrew Holmes "It is well to remember that the entire universe, with one trifling exception, is composed of others." Shhhhh.... I am not really here. I am a figment of your imagination.... I am still in my cave so this must be an illusion....
modified on Wednesday, June 16, 2010 10:47 PM
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Is it normal to have daily meetings lasting 1/2 hour, every issue being analyzed as to it's impact on the schedule. It's not pleasant and is in fact odd and seems to encourage hostilities. My first SCRUM project I worked on. Was just wondering?
Yes that is normal. It may not be pleasant, but it will definitely encourage accountability and responsibility.
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It sounds like they're using SCRUM for the wrong reasons. One place I was at it was an excuse to void organisng and acting like a laod of merchant bankers compelte with red braces. Yes, there is a euphemism in there as well.
Join the cool kids - Come fold with us[^]
Trollslayer wrote:
there is a euphemism in there as well
:laugh: how did you go getting gear for those contractors btw (what, 2 weeks ago now, you were having a longer weekend and had to find gear at the last moment - or did you use that axe you were muttering about ?) 'g'
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Is it normal to have daily meetings lasting 1/2 hour, every issue being analyzed as to it's impact on the schedule. It's not pleasant and is in fact odd and seems to encourage hostilities. My first SCRUM project I worked on. Was just wondering?
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Is it normal to have daily meetings lasting 1/2 hour, every issue being analyzed as to it's impact on the schedule. It's not pleasant and is in fact odd and seems to encourage hostilities. My first SCRUM project I worked on. Was just wondering?
We call them Stand-ups because everyone has to stand up. Believe me that makes it go faster. Also each person has only 3 major questions: 1) What did you do yesterday. 2) What are you doing today. 3) What are your blockers. This is the most important question. Normally I find that you don't have a blocker everyday. Another thing to remember is to keep the number of people down. If it gets to big you probably arn't don't agile effectively. My standups last from 5-10 minutes.
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Is it normal to have daily meetings lasting 1/2 hour, every issue being analyzed as to it's impact on the schedule. It's not pleasant and is in fact odd and seems to encourage hostilities. My first SCRUM project I worked on. Was just wondering?
It sounds like you have PM pretending to be a SCRUM Master.. The Daily SCRUM Meeting otherwise known as the "Stand Up" Requires each SCRUM team member to stand up and answer the following 3 questions 1. What did you get done yesterday? 2. What will you do today? 3. Are there any obstacles?
if (ToErr == Human.Nature) { Forgive = Divine; }
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Trollslayer wrote:
there is a euphemism in there as well
:laugh: how did you go getting gear for those contractors btw (what, 2 weeks ago now, you were having a longer weekend and had to find gear at the last moment - or did you use that axe you were muttering about ?) 'g'
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Chris Losinger wrote:
ruthlessly prioritizing everything
Chris Losinger wrote:
if development screws that up, and makes the sales team look bad, then development is going to be in a world of sh*t.
This started from day one (2 weeks ago). Delivery date is 6 months out
Surely if the delivery date is 6 months away then that would be a scrum marathon rather than a sprint?
ChrisB ChrisDoesDev[^]
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Is it normal to have daily meetings lasting 1/2 hour, every issue being analyzed as to it's impact on the schedule. It's not pleasant and is in fact odd and seems to encourage hostilities. My first SCRUM project I worked on. Was just wondering?
No - take the chairs out of that meeting room. It is becoming a school staffroom meeting rather than a scrum.
'--8<------------------------ Ex Datis: Duncan Jones Free eBook: Printing - a .NET Developer's Guide (Part 1)
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We have a 15 minute meeting every morning at 9:45AM and they are quite useful IMHO.
Rob Caldecott wrote:
We have a 15 minute meeting every morning at 9:45AM and they are quite useful IMHO.
that would seem about right IMO. anything longer and it can potentially work against productivity.
---Guy H ;-)---
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kmg365 wrote:
My first SCRUM project I worked on. Was just wondering?
from one of many SCRUM sources, I tried to convince others that this is how it should be... but with one meeting lasting 2 hours we never had more than one a week and sometimes we couldn't stomach that. Anyhow... try these rules on for a spin:
Before You Scrum Before holding your first scrum, your team – with the help of management – must decide what projects should be completed in the next 15 to 30 days – a time period known as the sprint. At the end of the sprint, your team is expected to have completed all assigned work. Also, it's important to remind managers that their job is not to tell the team members how to do their work, explains Schwaber, but instead to be their coach and help them succeed. Rules for Scrum Meetings * Choose a scrum leader to enforce the rules during the sprint * Hold scrums every day in the same location and at the same time - preferably first thing in the morning * Each scrum should last only 15 to 30 minutes * Ask all participants the same three questions: What did you do since the last scrum? What are you going to do between now and the next scrum? Is anything in the way of you doing your work? * Address issues other than the three questions outside the scrum – this includes suggestions for a team member who's hit a roadblock * Managers are not allowed to speak * If a manager or colleague assigns unplanned work to a team member that will throw the team's schedule off track, the scrum leader has the power to excuse the person of the additional work. The work must either be fit into the next sprint or be assigned to someone who's not on the team. * Your team must have a concrete deliverable for management after the sprint * Start the process again after each sprint
_________________________ John Andrew Holmes "It is well to remember that the entire universe, with one trifling exception, is composed of others." Shhhhh.... I am not really here. I am a figment of your imagination.... I am still in my cave so this must be an illusion....
modified on Wednesday, June 16, 2010 10:47 PM
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Surely if the delivery date is 6 months away then that would be a scrum marathon rather than a sprint?
ChrisB ChrisDoesDev[^]
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Is it normal to have daily meetings lasting 1/2 hour, every issue being analyzed as to it's impact on the schedule. It's not pleasant and is in fact odd and seems to encourage hostilities. My first SCRUM project I worked on. Was just wondering?
Ditto what the above have repeated a few times! :) But it sounds like your scrums have turned into status meetings. Poke your scrum-master a bit to see if they can get it corrected.
ed ~"Watch your thoughts; they become your words. Watch your words they become your actions. Watch your actions; they become your habits. Watch your habits; they become your character. Watch your character; it becomes your destiny." -Frank Outlaw.
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kmg365 wrote:
Is it normal to have daily meetings lasting 1/2 hour
Meeting length has less to do with the product and the methods than the people. Talk to me when you've survived a two hour session of "You broke ... Jeff, fix it." Our longest meeting was 4.5 hours I think... I've lost track there have been soooooo many and they all ended up being complete wastes of time and just power-plays. The caller of those meetings now owns his own business. :-D
_________________________ John Andrew Holmes "It is well to remember that the entire universe, with one trifling exception, is composed of others." Shhhhh.... I am not really here. I am a figment of your imagination.... I am still in my cave so this must be an illusion....
1,2 hours..Lightweight! I once had a meeting in america that went on for 2 DAYS! till midnight both night. 3 months designing of this application. head guy says he knows best then drag everyone into a meeting to talk him through our design. To which he then argues every point out so eventually he does it all his way. Day 2 involved him sitting with us redesigning the whole thing in MS Project page by page. I remember my team lead thumping me in the leg as my eyes had started to close and head nod back. 6 month deadline arrive....missed, 8 months.. missed. 9 months team lead walks. half the team goes contracting. 1 year later no product delivered. parent company fires everyone inc the annoying manager who rewrote it all HAHAHAHAHA. Im now IPhone programming. if it doesnt get delivered its my fault noone elses ..scary but rewarding. tend to clarify your mind when you have real customers and not clients :and all the bugs are yours and not someone elses. feature creep is avoided :)
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We have a 15 minute meeting every morning at 9:45AM and they are quite useful IMHO.
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Rob Caldecott wrote:
We have a 15 minute meeting every morning at 9:45AM and they are quite useful IMHO.
that would seem about right IMO. anything longer and it can potentially work against productivity.
---Guy H ;-)---
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1,2 hours..Lightweight! I once had a meeting in america that went on for 2 DAYS! till midnight both night. 3 months designing of this application. head guy says he knows best then drag everyone into a meeting to talk him through our design. To which he then argues every point out so eventually he does it all his way. Day 2 involved him sitting with us redesigning the whole thing in MS Project page by page. I remember my team lead thumping me in the leg as my eyes had started to close and head nod back. 6 month deadline arrive....missed, 8 months.. missed. 9 months team lead walks. half the team goes contracting. 1 year later no product delivered. parent company fires everyone inc the annoying manager who rewrote it all HAHAHAHAHA. Im now IPhone programming. if it doesnt get delivered its my fault noone elses ..scary but rewarding. tend to clarify your mind when you have real customers and not clients :and all the bugs are yours and not someone elses. feature creep is avoided :)
clearbrian1 wrote:
I once had a meeting in america that went on for 2 DAYS! till midnight both night. 3 months designing of this application. head guy says he knows best then drag everyone into a meeting to talk him through our design. To which he then argues every point out so eventually he does it all his way. Day 2 involved him sitting with us redesigning the whole thing in MS Project page by page. I remember my team lead thumping me in the leg as my eyes had started to close and head nod back.
Well, it's nice to know how CLK's previous employment worked out... actually, ours was a peer. He went to CMMI class so the PL assigned him to keep us inline with CMMI, he decided that that awarded him as Code Nazi. We did have one two day planning meeting, but the PL at least paid for a conference room at a hotel.... Planning meetings can go on forever. No this was our equivalent for a SCRUM meeting. It was a keep on track purpose, but the weekly meeting was more accusation and arguing from the one peer. Even though he was not our superior, we all learned that if you don't at least go along with what was said, it will last forever. I called it our weekly ass chewing meeting.
_________________________ John Andrew Holmes "It is well to remember that the entire universe, with one trifling exception, is composed of others." Shhhhh.... I am not really here. I am a figment of your imagination.... I am still in my cave so this must be an illusion....