MS has lost it all! Time to move on?
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http://www.scroogled.com/[^] I learnt a lesson in childhood which I follow like a religion. To make a line shorter, all you have to do is draw a bigger line. So if you want to beat competition, offer better product services. Rather than trying to be innovative, they tried to follow Mr. Steve Jobs way. Kill desktop and shift to tablets. Try to get a pie in every segment where others are doing well. Bad. Windows 8 tells the story. So MS has started crying like a child and shouting foul. Have we forgotten how you managed Netscape? I am convinced by every passing days that MS has it's golden days over. Android, Unity, Processing framework is looking more promising than any MS products. MS has officially stopped supporting XNA and God knows what else. Instead of spending millions in such stupid campaigns, if they had focused on spending constructively on developers, they would have had a better probability of catching up. I can't imagine life without Youtube, Gmail, Chrome and Google. It is same for Windows OS , Office Suite and C#. But as you have decided to dump products that I need, I have decided to move on. Someone give some sense to Mr. Steve Ballmer.
Gee, aren't you a bunch of whiners... :(( :mad: MS definitely has it's flaws, but buddy, what would the world look like without MS Office, and without the terrific Visual Studio development platform, both products that are at the top leaving other players chewing dust. :omg: C#.NET may have been originally a copycat of Java but it's far superior in features and capabilities at least out of the box * Don't get the [wrong] impression that I have any positive feeling towards Mr. Ballmer but MS has definitely made life of developments and debugging MUCH easier and nicer One should know to say the good even if it has become the obvious.
Cheees, Edo
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http://www.scroogled.com/[^] I learnt a lesson in childhood which I follow like a religion. To make a line shorter, all you have to do is draw a bigger line. So if you want to beat competition, offer better product services. Rather than trying to be innovative, they tried to follow Mr. Steve Jobs way. Kill desktop and shift to tablets. Try to get a pie in every segment where others are doing well. Bad. Windows 8 tells the story. So MS has started crying like a child and shouting foul. Have we forgotten how you managed Netscape? I am convinced by every passing days that MS has it's golden days over. Android, Unity, Processing framework is looking more promising than any MS products. MS has officially stopped supporting XNA and God knows what else. Instead of spending millions in such stupid campaigns, if they had focused on spending constructively on developers, they would have had a better probability of catching up. I can't imagine life without Youtube, Gmail, Chrome and Google. It is same for Windows OS , Office Suite and C#. But as you have decided to dump products that I need, I have decided to move on. Someone give some sense to Mr. Steve Ballmer.
I agree, but would also mention an elephant in the room you overlooked: LEGACY. Microsoft have lots of skilled people, but just like all other behemoths they aren't in a position to just make something brand new, stop spending resources on their old stuff, and ignore the existing customer base. Which is just to repeat that they have legacy. :)
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Gee, aren't you a bunch of whiners... :(( :mad: MS definitely has it's flaws, but buddy, what would the world look like without MS Office, and without the terrific Visual Studio development platform, both products that are at the top leaving other players chewing dust. :omg: C#.NET may have been originally a copycat of Java but it's far superior in features and capabilities at least out of the box * Don't get the [wrong] impression that I have any positive feeling towards Mr. Ballmer but MS has definitely made life of developments and debugging MUCH easier and nicer One should know to say the good even if it has become the obvious.
Cheees, Edo
I don't see that you made a point. :) Nobody's saying, as far as I've noticed, that MS hasn't ever done anything great. To the contrary, it's being said MS is past its golden days. I'm a developer living in an almost entirely MS universe; Windows, MSSQL, BizTalk, SharePoint, IIS, .net, msmq - and VS, TFS, and so on. And although I have limited experience with the competition's servers and devtools, I like a lot of the stuff MS gives us, and believe I would need lots more tools (making life more complicated) if I were to make the same software without MS products. And still I think MS is basically shot. They have so much legacy that they can't change fast enough to have a chance. Technological breakthrough nearly always means disruption, but not that things remain unstable forever. MS was disrupted by the internet. Just like they had a stronghold in the PC market, others now control the new markets, and MS is now one of the many players that face barriers to entry, rather than being the one setting up and maintaining them.
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Mark_Wallace wrote:
I don't use my real name for anything on the Internet
So who are you then if you are not Mark Wallace?
Dave Find Me On: Web|Facebook|Twitter|LinkedIn
Folding Stats: Team CodeProject
He's Sharon Osbourne.
I was brought up to respect my elders. I don't respect many people nowadays.
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier -
http://www.scroogled.com/[^] I learnt a lesson in childhood which I follow like a religion. To make a line shorter, all you have to do is draw a bigger line. So if you want to beat competition, offer better product services. Rather than trying to be innovative, they tried to follow Mr. Steve Jobs way. Kill desktop and shift to tablets. Try to get a pie in every segment where others are doing well. Bad. Windows 8 tells the story. So MS has started crying like a child and shouting foul. Have we forgotten how you managed Netscape? I am convinced by every passing days that MS has it's golden days over. Android, Unity, Processing framework is looking more promising than any MS products. MS has officially stopped supporting XNA and God knows what else. Instead of spending millions in such stupid campaigns, if they had focused on spending constructively on developers, they would have had a better probability of catching up. I can't imagine life without Youtube, Gmail, Chrome and Google. It is same for Windows OS , Office Suite and C#. But as you have decided to dump products that I need, I have decided to move on. Someone give some sense to Mr. Steve Ballmer.
Grasshopper.iics wrote:
Try to get a pie in every segment where others are doing well.
By that argument, Google shouldn't have released Android. What would you suggest? Should Microsoft be content to watch as tablets take off and they don't have a presence there. I've spoken to a lot of developers about W8 and the overlying opinion is that they might have given it a chance if Microsoft hadn't been so arrogant and switched off the start button and removed the boot straight to desktop option. Possibly Microsoft's biggest weakness right now is that it is so massively secretive. There are so many things that are going on that are heavily NDAd that teams are constrained from getting real feedback. Take the debacle over the release of the WP8 SDK. MS releases a major new platform, but doesn't provide the tooling for people to start developing for it until a couple of days before launch. Yet no one in the team saw fit to ask the question "wait a second, if we want quality applications in the store on day one, shouldn't we be getting this to people before the release"?
Grasshopper.iics wrote:
Someone give some sense to Mr. Steve Ballmer.
As much as I think the man's a fool, historically it's not been Steve Ballmer who has been responsible for killing off product lines in Microsoft. Talking to insiders, the same story comes up time and time again; it's internal politics. One manager thinks another manager is encroaching on his or her space and they convince the level above to kill the project.
I was brought up to respect my elders. I don't respect many people nowadays.
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier -
He's Sharon Osbourne.
I was brought up to respect my elders. I don't respect many people nowadays.
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier -
Gee, aren't you a bunch of whiners... :(( :mad: MS definitely has it's flaws, but buddy, what would the world look like without MS Office, and without the terrific Visual Studio development platform, both products that are at the top leaving other players chewing dust. :omg: C#.NET may have been originally a copycat of Java but it's far superior in features and capabilities at least out of the box * Don't get the [wrong] impression that I have any positive feeling towards Mr. Ballmer but MS has definitely made life of developments and debugging MUCH easier and nicer One should know to say the good even if it has become the obvious.
Cheees, Edo
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Grasshopper.iics wrote:
Try to get a pie in every segment where others are doing well.
By that argument, Google shouldn't have released Android. What would you suggest? Should Microsoft be content to watch as tablets take off and they don't have a presence there. I've spoken to a lot of developers about W8 and the overlying opinion is that they might have given it a chance if Microsoft hadn't been so arrogant and switched off the start button and removed the boot straight to desktop option. Possibly Microsoft's biggest weakness right now is that it is so massively secretive. There are so many things that are going on that are heavily NDAd that teams are constrained from getting real feedback. Take the debacle over the release of the WP8 SDK. MS releases a major new platform, but doesn't provide the tooling for people to start developing for it until a couple of days before launch. Yet no one in the team saw fit to ask the question "wait a second, if we want quality applications in the store on day one, shouldn't we be getting this to people before the release"?
Grasshopper.iics wrote:
Someone give some sense to Mr. Steve Ballmer.
As much as I think the man's a fool, historically it's not been Steve Ballmer who has been responsible for killing off product lines in Microsoft. Talking to insiders, the same story comes up time and time again; it's internal politics. One manager thinks another manager is encroaching on his or her space and they convince the level above to kill the project.
I was brought up to respect my elders. I don't respect many people nowadays.
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easierSteve Ballmer may be a fool in your eyes but he was smart enough to become the second person after Roberto Goizueta to become a billionaire :cool: in U.S. dollars based on stock options received as an employee of a corporation in which he was neither a founder nor a relative of a founder!!
Cheees, Edo
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Edo Tzumer wrote:
but MS has definitely made life of developments and debugging MUCH easier and nicer
Except when you hit F12 in IE compared to Chrome!!!
Dave Find Me On: Web|Facebook|Twitter|LinkedIn
Folding Stats: Team CodeProject
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Mark_Wallace wrote:
I don't use my real name for anything on the Internet
So who are you then if you are not Mark Wallace?
Dave Find Me On: Web|Facebook|Twitter|LinkedIn
Folding Stats: Team CodeProject
Mark Wallace is a character in a story I wrote under the name Mark Wallace. I was hoping that by doing that, I'd disappear up my own backside (Goodbye, cruel world!), but it didn't work.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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Grasshopper.iics wrote:
Try to get a pie in every segment where others are doing well.
By that argument, Google shouldn't have released Android. What would you suggest? Should Microsoft be content to watch as tablets take off and they don't have a presence there. I've spoken to a lot of developers about W8 and the overlying opinion is that they might have given it a chance if Microsoft hadn't been so arrogant and switched off the start button and removed the boot straight to desktop option. Possibly Microsoft's biggest weakness right now is that it is so massively secretive. There are so many things that are going on that are heavily NDAd that teams are constrained from getting real feedback. Take the debacle over the release of the WP8 SDK. MS releases a major new platform, but doesn't provide the tooling for people to start developing for it until a couple of days before launch. Yet no one in the team saw fit to ask the question "wait a second, if we want quality applications in the store on day one, shouldn't we be getting this to people before the release"?
Grasshopper.iics wrote:
Someone give some sense to Mr. Steve Ballmer.
As much as I think the man's a fool, historically it's not been Steve Ballmer who has been responsible for killing off product lines in Microsoft. Talking to insiders, the same story comes up time and time again; it's internal politics. One manager thinks another manager is encroaching on his or her space and they convince the level above to kill the project.
I was brought up to respect my elders. I don't respect many people nowadays.
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easierGood Point Made. Companies would try to explore new horizons and that's how technology and product companies survive. Apple is not trying to get into search business, they tried Map. :-D Google is not trying to make a Biz server. They are advertisement dependent. So they would try to enter into every Media thing where they can push advertisement, Search, Video, Social Network, News, Android, Adsense, Gmail and yes chrome is there to boost their advertisement revenue. They pushed Chrome to counter Firefox's turn off advertisement feature. Simple. Apple's business is their store, iTunes and Apps. They will follow a product line where people would need Apps, Tabs, iPad, iPod.... ( may be iWatch, iTV, iGame) etc. Don't be surprised to see an Apple product made especially for gaming or so. MS is on the other hand better off to it's License based Products. Office, OS, VS, Server OS. Now what they are trying to do? Enter into App market in the model of Apple and Enter into internet with the model of Google. They want a good Mobile platform. Why? So that they can push Bing and their App store. Historically Google has never dumped a popular product for another. Adsense is not killed for Android. Strategically they have combined their main business. But MS has faltered. They introduced Silverlight ( way smoother than Flash) only to kill it. They started with XNA, killed it. Can you claim for sure that WinRT is here to stay? But I can say that AdSense is going to be there in 2015, Youtube will also be there and so will the Android be ( Unless any of it is killed by severe competition). MS has given great products only to abandon it. I hope I made my point Pete.
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Good Point Made. Companies would try to explore new horizons and that's how technology and product companies survive. Apple is not trying to get into search business, they tried Map. :-D Google is not trying to make a Biz server. They are advertisement dependent. So they would try to enter into every Media thing where they can push advertisement, Search, Video, Social Network, News, Android, Adsense, Gmail and yes chrome is there to boost their advertisement revenue. They pushed Chrome to counter Firefox's turn off advertisement feature. Simple. Apple's business is their store, iTunes and Apps. They will follow a product line where people would need Apps, Tabs, iPad, iPod.... ( may be iWatch, iTV, iGame) etc. Don't be surprised to see an Apple product made especially for gaming or so. MS is on the other hand better off to it's License based Products. Office, OS, VS, Server OS. Now what they are trying to do? Enter into App market in the model of Apple and Enter into internet with the model of Google. They want a good Mobile platform. Why? So that they can push Bing and their App store. Historically Google has never dumped a popular product for another. Adsense is not killed for Android. Strategically they have combined their main business. But MS has faltered. They introduced Silverlight ( way smoother than Flash) only to kill it. They started with XNA, killed it. Can you claim for sure that WinRT is here to stay? But I can say that AdSense is going to be there in 2015, Youtube will also be there and so will the Android be ( Unless any of it is killed by severe competition). MS has given great products only to abandon it. I hope I made my point Pete.
To a certain extent I agree, but I would debate with you about Google not killing products - they have been going through significant churn there. My point is just that Microsoft has had to adapt. They were complacent for a long time and, all of a sudden, the world has changed. Where Microsoft is really hampered is in the need to support legacy systems. If WinRT had been better named and a completely separate product, it might have been better received.
I was brought up to respect my elders. I don't respect many people nowadays.
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier -
Steve Ballmer may be a fool in your eyes but he was smart enough to become the second person after Roberto Goizueta to become a billionaire :cool: in U.S. dollars based on stock options received as an employee of a corporation in which he was neither a founder nor a relative of a founder!!
Cheees, Edo
Edo Tzumer wrote:
Steve Ballmer may be a fool in your eyes but he was smart enough to become the second person after Roberto Goizueta to become a billionaire :cool: in U.S. dollars based on stock options received as an employee of a corporation in which he was neither a founder nor a relative of a founder!!
I see you have misspelt lucky.
Michael Martin Australia "I controlled my laughter and simple said "No,I am very busy,so I can't write any code for you". The moment they heard this all the smiling face turned into a sad looking face and one of them farted. So I had to leave the place as soon as possible." - Mr.Prakash One Fine Saturday. 24/04/2004
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Edo Tzumer wrote:
Steve Ballmer may be a fool in your eyes but he was smart enough to become the second person after Roberto Goizueta to become a billionaire :cool: in U.S. dollars based on stock options received as an employee of a corporation in which he was neither a founder nor a relative of a founder!!
I see you have misspelt lucky.
Michael Martin Australia "I controlled my laughter and simple said "No,I am very busy,so I can't write any code for you". The moment they heard this all the smiling face turned into a sad looking face and one of them farted. So I had to leave the place as soon as possible." - Mr.Prakash One Fine Saturday. 24/04/2004
Ahmmm, O :pause: K ... lucky ... Anyway, the clerk at Merriam Webster asked if you could please be so kind and send him the updated definition of
lucky, it seems the world up till now has been misinformed. The way I see this is the exact example of achieving without luck. Lucky would be Ballmer's son.Cheees, Edo
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Ahmmm, O :pause: K ... lucky ... Anyway, the clerk at Merriam Webster asked if you could please be so kind and send him the updated definition of
lucky, it seems the world up till now has been misinformed. The way I see this is the exact example of achieving without luck. Lucky would be Ballmer's son.Cheees, Edo
Edo Tzumer wrote:
Anyway, the clerk at Merriam Webster...
Faarrrkkkk off, that sunshine Webster can't spell for shite. It's Oxford or it's nothing.
Edo Tzumer wrote:
The way I see this is the exact example of achieving without luck.
Lucky would be Ballmer's son.Ballmer is a knob jockey who lucked out into a company that went places and where he just missed out on being fired multiple times for being an embarrassing cock. On his own ability, he would be dressed in a chicken suit outside Kentucky Fried Chicken.
Michael Martin Australia "I controlled my laughter and simple said "No,I am very busy,so I can't write any code for you". The moment they heard this all the smiling face turned into a sad looking face and one of them farted. So I had to leave the place as soon as possible." - Mr.Prakash One Fine Saturday. 24/04/2004
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http://www.scroogled.com/[^] I learnt a lesson in childhood which I follow like a religion. To make a line shorter, all you have to do is draw a bigger line. So if you want to beat competition, offer better product services. Rather than trying to be innovative, they tried to follow Mr. Steve Jobs way. Kill desktop and shift to tablets. Try to get a pie in every segment where others are doing well. Bad. Windows 8 tells the story. So MS has started crying like a child and shouting foul. Have we forgotten how you managed Netscape? I am convinced by every passing days that MS has it's golden days over. Android, Unity, Processing framework is looking more promising than any MS products. MS has officially stopped supporting XNA and God knows what else. Instead of spending millions in such stupid campaigns, if they had focused on spending constructively on developers, they would have had a better probability of catching up. I can't imagine life without Youtube, Gmail, Chrome and Google. It is same for Windows OS , Office Suite and C#. But as you have decided to dump products that I need, I have decided to move on. Someone give some sense to Mr. Steve Ballmer.
Grasshopper.iics wrote:
I am convinced by every passing days that MS has it's golden days over.
Myself I was never under the impression that MS was an innovator. They buy it and/or copy it and then sell it. They are good at selling. Of course companies that are not good at selling do not last. Doesn't matter how much they innovate.
Grasshopper.iics wrote:
MS has officially stopped supporting XNA and God knows what else.
MS has stopped supporting a vast array of technologies over the years. Perhaps this is just the first time you noticed.
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http://www.scroogled.com/[^] I learnt a lesson in childhood which I follow like a religion. To make a line shorter, all you have to do is draw a bigger line. So if you want to beat competition, offer better product services. Rather than trying to be innovative, they tried to follow Mr. Steve Jobs way. Kill desktop and shift to tablets. Try to get a pie in every segment where others are doing well. Bad. Windows 8 tells the story. So MS has started crying like a child and shouting foul. Have we forgotten how you managed Netscape? I am convinced by every passing days that MS has it's golden days over. Android, Unity, Processing framework is looking more promising than any MS products. MS has officially stopped supporting XNA and God knows what else. Instead of spending millions in such stupid campaigns, if they had focused on spending constructively on developers, they would have had a better probability of catching up. I can't imagine life without Youtube, Gmail, Chrome and Google. It is same for Windows OS , Office Suite and C#. But as you have decided to dump products that I need, I have decided to move on. Someone give some sense to Mr. Steve Ballmer.
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http://www.scroogled.com/[^] I learnt a lesson in childhood which I follow like a religion. To make a line shorter, all you have to do is draw a bigger line. So if you want to beat competition, offer better product services. Rather than trying to be innovative, they tried to follow Mr. Steve Jobs way. Kill desktop and shift to tablets. Try to get a pie in every segment where others are doing well. Bad. Windows 8 tells the story. So MS has started crying like a child and shouting foul. Have we forgotten how you managed Netscape? I am convinced by every passing days that MS has it's golden days over. Android, Unity, Processing framework is looking more promising than any MS products. MS has officially stopped supporting XNA and God knows what else. Instead of spending millions in such stupid campaigns, if they had focused on spending constructively on developers, they would have had a better probability of catching up. I can't imagine life without Youtube, Gmail, Chrome and Google. It is same for Windows OS , Office Suite and C#. But as you have decided to dump products that I need, I have decided to move on. Someone give some sense to Mr. Steve Ballmer.
That's one reason why I stay with VS2008 (the best version IMHO).
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That's one reason why I stay with VS2008 (the best version IMHO).
So True! Especially does really well for business software.
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Edo Tzumer wrote:
Anyway, the clerk at Merriam Webster...
Faarrrkkkk off, that sunshine Webster can't spell for shite. It's Oxford or it's nothing.
Edo Tzumer wrote:
The way I see this is the exact example of achieving without luck.
Lucky would be Ballmer's son.Ballmer is a knob jockey who lucked out into a company that went places and where he just missed out on being fired multiple times for being an embarrassing cock. On his own ability, he would be dressed in a chicken suit outside Kentucky Fried Chicken.
Michael Martin Australia "I controlled my laughter and simple said "No,I am very busy,so I can't write any code for you". The moment they heard this all the smiling face turned into a sad looking face and one of them farted. So I had to leave the place as soon as possible." - Mr.Prakash One Fine Saturday. 24/04/2004
Ahh, forget it... why do I need to defend Ballmer anyway :wtf: ? Go on and hate him if it makes your world better in anyway, although I disagree with you on this one, there are probably things he'd done :^) that are "worth" feeling unhealthy feelings ;)
Cheees, Edo