Time To Leave California
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http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=738035[^] Read the section just past the flag. These laws were ALL passed yesterday.
If it's not broken, fix it until it is
You have a problem, with, for example: "Senate Bill 108 - (Yee) requires mandatory locked storage of firearms within a locked house regardless of whether anyone is present." ??? Really ??? Marc
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http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=738035[^] Read the section just past the flag. These laws were ALL passed yesterday.
If it's not broken, fix it until it is
"You can check out any time you like but you can never leave." Sorry but it had to be said :-D
"The secret of happiness is freedom, and the secret of freedom, courage." Thucydides (B.C. 460-400)
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http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=738035[^] Read the section just past the flag. These laws were ALL passed yesterday.
If it's not broken, fix it until it is
Can you give a synopsis or another article? That site is blocked here.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair. nils illegitimus carborundum me, me, me
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http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=738035[^] Read the section just past the flag. These laws were ALL passed yesterday.
If it's not broken, fix it until it is
You people could argue that guns are good in safe hands, and "you" are not one of the bad guys, etc. But there have been way too much of gun related crimes and I'm glad that your government at least has the balls to try and do something about it. I'm sure you'll disagree stating that the bad guys will still have guns or whatever, but this is a start. If you move out of California now, I'm sure you'll be moving between several states soon, and then perhaps will soon look to move out to may be another country. If not getting bullet magazines with not more than 10 rounds in one set, or having to report the loss or theft of your automatic assault rifle within 48 hours are your biggest problems, you're a very happy man. Just move on with your life. Here's a link for you which gives more insight on the kind of "trauma" you're going through: first world problems vs real problems[^].
"Real men drive manual transmission" - Rajesh.
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http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=738035[^] Read the section just past the flag. These laws were ALL passed yesterday.
If it's not broken, fix it until it is
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Can you give a synopsis or another article? That site is blocked here.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair. nils illegitimus carborundum me, me, me
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-04-16/california-gun-restrictions-clear-first-hurdle-in-senate.html[^] [Disclaimer] - The author is my brother
If it's not broken, fix it until it is
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You have a problem, with, for example: "Senate Bill 108 - (Yee) requires mandatory locked storage of firearms within a locked house regardless of whether anyone is present." ??? Really ??? Marc
Testers Wanted!
Latest Article: User Authentication on Ruby on Rails - the definitive how to
My BlogMarc Clifton wrote:
You have a problem, with, for example: "Senate Bill 108 - (Yee) requires mandatory locked storage of firearms within a locked house regardless of whether anyone is present."
Absolutely. I have real issues with the government telling me what to do in my own home. It's not the place of the gov to decide what happens in my house.
If it's not broken, fix it until it is
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http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=738035[^] Read the section just past the flag. These laws were ALL passed yesterday.
If it's not broken, fix it until it is
You're just figuring that out now? The Peoples' Republic of California became uninhabitable by Americans or other decent people about 30 years ago, possibly a bit earlier. I just failed to notice it until I left and returned to the United States. The insidious creep of Socialism and Nanny Statism is difficult to notice when you're living within it, but it's glaringly obvious once you escape. Perhaps more accurately, this is the horror of true Democracy, where every half-baked loony who wants to tell his neighbors what they may think and say and do can get elected to office and pass insane laws. That probably is a better description of the PRC than Socialist.
Will Rogers never met me.
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http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=738035[^] Read the section just past the flag. These laws were ALL passed yesterday.
If it's not broken, fix it until it is
Quote:
Senate Bill 567 - (Jackson) changes the technical definition of a shotgun, which would turn all handguns into short-barrel shotguns that are illegal to own.
Are you sure this one was passed and is legit? Seems like a full ban on handguns would have made the main stream media.
Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master. ~ George Washington
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You people could argue that guns are good in safe hands, and "you" are not one of the bad guys, etc. But there have been way too much of gun related crimes and I'm glad that your government at least has the balls to try and do something about it. I'm sure you'll disagree stating that the bad guys will still have guns or whatever, but this is a start. If you move out of California now, I'm sure you'll be moving between several states soon, and then perhaps will soon look to move out to may be another country. If not getting bullet magazines with not more than 10 rounds in one set, or having to report the loss or theft of your automatic assault rifle within 48 hours are your biggest problems, you're a very happy man. Just move on with your life. Here's a link for you which gives more insight on the kind of "trauma" you're going through: first world problems vs real problems[^].
"Real men drive manual transmission" - Rajesh.
Are you saying too much goat cheese in my salad is not a serious issue!? Blasphemy! I'm going to take my complaint to the nearest social network! /ravi
My new year resolution: 2048 x 1536 Home | Articles | My .NET bits | Freeware ravib(at)ravib(dot)com
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Quote:
Senate Bill 567 - (Jackson) changes the technical definition of a shotgun, which would turn all handguns into short-barrel shotguns that are illegal to own.
Are you sure this one was passed and is legit? Seems like a full ban on handguns would have made the main stream media.
Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master. ~ George Washington
I haven't read the bill, but I suspect that they changed the definition to include anything capable of firing shot, without clarifying it more fully. Technically, that would make a pistol into a shotgun, since CCI makes shotshells for the .38 Special and .22 LR calibers, and others under the name "SnakeShot" or "RatShot." Since Federal law bans a shotgun with a barrel under 18" in length or so, this definition would make nearly every gun owner in the state a felon, since most of them own at least one pistol that could accept a shotshell of some kind. Far fetched, and I think you'd have trouble getting even a far left-wing Liberal judge in the PRC to go along with it, but it could be enforced. It's always risky when you live in a place like that, where everything you might ever want to do is either required by law, taxed and licensed, or illegal with a heavy fine, or about to be one or the other, depending on which loony gets the most votes this week.
Will Rogers never met me.
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Marc Clifton wrote:
You have a problem, with, for example: "Senate Bill 108 - (Yee) requires mandatory locked storage of firearms within a locked house regardless of whether anyone is present."
Absolutely. I have real issues with the government telling me what to do in my own home. It's not the place of the gov to decide what happens in my house.
If it's not broken, fix it until it is
Kevin Marois wrote:
Absolutely. I have real issues with the government telling me what to do in my own home.
It's not the place of the gov to decide what happens in my house.OK, but then I have the expectation that if you leave guns unlocked and accessible, and a burglar steals them and then kills someone with your weapons, or kills a policeman responding to a burglary with your weapons, that you are held accountable as if you had committed the murder yourself. [edit]Furthermore, if a child kills himself or a friend accidentally, I would expect that you be held accountable as if you had killed that child yourself. [/edit] Would you disagree? Marc
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Kevin Marois wrote:
Absolutely. I have real issues with the government telling me what to do in my own home.
It's not the place of the gov to decide what happens in my house.OK, but then I have the expectation that if you leave guns unlocked and accessible, and a burglar steals them and then kills someone with your weapons, or kills a policeman responding to a burglary with your weapons, that you are held accountable as if you had committed the murder yourself. [edit]Furthermore, if a child kills himself or a friend accidentally, I would expect that you be held accountable as if you had killed that child yourself. [/edit] Would you disagree? Marc
Testers Wanted!
Latest Article: User Authentication on Ruby on Rails - the definitive how to
My BlogMarc Clifton wrote:
... and a burglar steals them and then kills someone with your weapons, or kills a policeman responding to a burglary with your weapons, that you are held accountable as if you had committed the murder yourself.
Would you disagree?You're joking, right? Of course I disagree. Are you responsible if someone steals your car and kills someone with it?
If it's not broken, fix it until it is
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Marc Clifton wrote:
... and a burglar steals them and then kills someone with your weapons, or kills a policeman responding to a burglary with your weapons, that you are held accountable as if you had committed the murder yourself.
Would you disagree?You're joking, right? Of course I disagree. Are you responsible if someone steals your car and kills someone with it?
If it's not broken, fix it until it is
Kevin Marois wrote:
You're joking, right?
No, I'm not joking. I see we are at an impasse then. And the analogy of someone stealing my car is fallacious. If you choose to leave guns unlocked in your home, then you are acting irresponsibly. The law is there only because people are incapable of responsible behavior. And that is why you should be held accountable for someone that commits a crime with your gun (the person committing the crime should too, of course, but you are not in any way less responsible.) Marc
Testers Wanted!
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Kevin Marois wrote:
You're joking, right?
No, I'm not joking. I see we are at an impasse then. And the analogy of someone stealing my car is fallacious. If you choose to leave guns unlocked in your home, then you are acting irresponsibly. The law is there only because people are incapable of responsible behavior. And that is why you should be held accountable for someone that commits a crime with your gun (the person committing the crime should too, of course, but you are not in any way less responsible.) Marc
Testers Wanted!
Latest Article: User Authentication on Ruby on Rails - the definitive how to
My BlogUm, whaa?
Marc Clifton wrote:
And the analogy of someone stealing my car is fallacious. If you choose to leave guns unlocked in your home, then you are acting irresponsibly.
How does me leaving my personal posessions unlocked in my own home make me irresponsible??? My kitchen stove isn't locked. Left on it could burn the house down and kill people. I have dangerous cleaning supplies under my sink. They're not locked up. Does that make me irresponsible? I have hammers & knives around my house that are unlocked. What about them?
Marc Clifton wrote:
And that is why you should be held accountable for someone that commits a crime with your gun
You didn't answer my question... If I leave my car unlocked, and someone takes it, and runs over & kills someone else..... how is that my fault in any way? Someone killing someone with a stolen car is a fallacy? Really? Should I be held responsible if someone commits a crime with my [insert object name here]?
If it's not broken, fix it until it is
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Oh dear. Can't talk about things of substance in the lounge! :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader.-John Q. Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering.-Wernher von Braun
Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.-Albert EinsteinCodeProject Lounge Posting Guidelins: "4. No politics (including enviro-politics[^]), no sex, no religion. This is a community for software development. There are plenty of other sites that are far more appropriate for these discussions. Or if you must, use the Back Room[^] - but enter at your own risk." yours, Bill
“Be patient toward all that is unsolved in your heart, and try to love the questions themselves, like locked rooms, and like books that are now written in a very foreign tongue. Do not now seek the answers, which cannot be given you because you would not be able to live them. And the point is, to live everything. Live the questions now. Perhaps you will then gradually, without noticing it, live along some distant day into the answer.”
Rainer Maria Rilke
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Inappropriate material for the lounge, marked as abuse.
Reality is an illusion caused by a lack of alcohol
Glad you spoke out, Nagy, as I did. thanks, Bill
“Be patient toward all that is unsolved in your heart, and try to love the questions themselves, like locked rooms, and like books that are now written in a very foreign tongue. Do not now seek the answers, which cannot be given you because you would not be able to live them. And the point is, to live everything. Live the questions now. Perhaps you will then gradually, without noticing it, live along some distant day into the answer.”
Rainer Maria Rilke
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CodeProject Lounge Posting Guidelins: "4. No politics (including enviro-politics[^]), no sex, no religion. This is a community for software development. There are plenty of other sites that are far more appropriate for these discussions. Or if you must, use the Back Room[^] - but enter at your own risk." yours, Bill
“Be patient toward all that is unsolved in your heart, and try to love the questions themselves, like locked rooms, and like books that are now written in a very foreign tongue. Do not now seek the answers, which cannot be given you because you would not be able to live them. And the point is, to live everything. Live the questions now. Perhaps you will then gradually, without noticing it, live along some distant day into the answer.”
Rainer Maria Rilke
yes, I'm aware of that. and I don't agree with it. boohoo.
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader.-John Q. Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering.-Wernher von Braun
Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.-Albert Einstein -
Um, whaa?
Marc Clifton wrote:
And the analogy of someone stealing my car is fallacious. If you choose to leave guns unlocked in your home, then you are acting irresponsibly.
How does me leaving my personal posessions unlocked in my own home make me irresponsible??? My kitchen stove isn't locked. Left on it could burn the house down and kill people. I have dangerous cleaning supplies under my sink. They're not locked up. Does that make me irresponsible? I have hammers & knives around my house that are unlocked. What about them?
Marc Clifton wrote:
And that is why you should be held accountable for someone that commits a crime with your gun
You didn't answer my question... If I leave my car unlocked, and someone takes it, and runs over & kills someone else..... how is that my fault in any way? Someone killing someone with a stolen car is a fallacy? Really? Should I be held responsible if someone commits a crime with my [insert object name here]?
If it's not broken, fix it until it is
Kevin Marois wrote:
You didn't answer my question... If I leave my car unlocked, and someone takes it, and runs over & kills someone else..... how is that my fault in any way? Someone killing someone with a stolen car is a fallacy? Really?
Any analogy to a car is pointless. What is the primary purpose for the manufacture of a car? Well, isn't it to transport people and goods? What is the primary purpose for the manufacture of a gun? Isn't it to kill? Even the "deterrent" argument doesn't hold water -- why does it work as a deterrent? Well, because of fear of injury or death. So, the analogy to most other things is pointless, certainly to a car. But we can go further. All cars have locks. Almost have car has a passive security system, remote control, etc. All that is designed to prevent the misuse of a car in the event of theft. Does a gun come with locks and antitheft security systems? No. Again, the analogy falls apart with a little thought. It is therefore your responsibility to protect your gun, and if you fail to do so, I content that you are responsible for that failure. We can go even further. Do I need a license to own and operate a gun? No. Am I required to get training before operating a gun? No. Is the gun easily concealable? Yes. So, my point is, the analogy is completely inappropriate. Why don't you make an analogy with say, a missile? Or maybe a pressure cooker. (that was a joke) If that idiot of a mother had locked her guns in her apartment in Newtown, a lot of kids would still be alive, including her. Marc
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Kevin Marois wrote:
You didn't answer my question... If I leave my car unlocked, and someone takes it, and runs over & kills someone else..... how is that my fault in any way? Someone killing someone with a stolen car is a fallacy? Really?
Any analogy to a car is pointless. What is the primary purpose for the manufacture of a car? Well, isn't it to transport people and goods? What is the primary purpose for the manufacture of a gun? Isn't it to kill? Even the "deterrent" argument doesn't hold water -- why does it work as a deterrent? Well, because of fear of injury or death. So, the analogy to most other things is pointless, certainly to a car. But we can go further. All cars have locks. Almost have car has a passive security system, remote control, etc. All that is designed to prevent the misuse of a car in the event of theft. Does a gun come with locks and antitheft security systems? No. Again, the analogy falls apart with a little thought. It is therefore your responsibility to protect your gun, and if you fail to do so, I content that you are responsible for that failure. We can go even further. Do I need a license to own and operate a gun? No. Am I required to get training before operating a gun? No. Is the gun easily concealable? Yes. So, my point is, the analogy is completely inappropriate. Why don't you make an analogy with say, a missile? Or maybe a pressure cooker. (that was a joke) If that idiot of a mother had locked her guns in her apartment in Newtown, a lot of kids would still be alive, including her. Marc
Testers Wanted!
Latest Article: User Authentication on Ruby on Rails - the definitive how to
My BlogMarc Clifton wrote:
So, the analogy to most other things is pointless, certainly to a car.
I just don't get how you can say the analogy here is pointless, when both a car & a gun are weapons, and cars kill far more people than guns.
Marc Clifton wrote:
What is the primary purpose for the manufacture of a gun? Isn't it to kill?
That's your opinion. I own guns. I didn't buy them to kill. I bought them to target shoot, which I do regularly. I'v never killed anyone with my gun. The purpose of guns is subjective.
Marc Clifton wrote:
But we can go further. All cars have locks.
Um, no, all cars don't have locks. New model cars do. Not all cars have security systems, unless you call the useless blinking light on the dashboard a security system. My car doesn't have one, and it's a 2011.
Marc Clifton wrote:
It is therefore your responsibility to protect your gun, and if you fail to do so, I content that you are responsible for that failure.
If I left a loaded gun on the front porch, then you're right. Just as if I had left my car running and some kid got in. But when my gun is in my house, where no one but me has a lock to, then it's secured. And the law agrees with me. Notice I didn't saw the politicians agree with me. Hence the new legislation. If someone broke into my house & stole a crossbow & killed someone with it, should I be arrested? My guns are stored in a locked closet. If someone kicked down the door, which anyone could do, and stole my shotgun and killed someone with it, should I be prosecuted? All my guns have gun locks/cables on them. If someone stole my gun, cut off the lock, and killed someone with it should I be prosecuted?
Marc Clifton wrote:
If that idiot of a mother had locked her guns in her apartment in Newtown, a lot of kids would still be alive, including her.
Are you kidding? You're not serious? That nutjob would have used some other weapon. Like a bomb in a backpack. You're speaking out of fear & frustration, which I understand and sympathize with. But if you (and the brain dead idiots writing laws) would just do some simple fact checking, you (and they) would see that most law abiding citizens don't commit crimes with guns. It's true. The crime rate
