My Unit Testing e-book is published!
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Your message is garbled beyond belief, but I'll try and reply. If I want to find out something, I go to a source that I trust. Big word that, trust. Now, I know who Marc is and I trust him, so I will read his well priced book. If I then found something I wasn't sure about I would go elsewhere. However the point I and Pete made, and you have fully ignored in your replies, is that your original post was based on no in depth reading of the book. You could barely have read the preface or conclusion, let alone skimmed through the content, before you commented. So where do you get the material for your opinion? You can't say another book is better or more in depth if you haven't read them both. Completely. Your opinion I will leave and Marc's I will take. That way I'll learn something.
Reality is an illusion caused by a lack of alcohol "Nagy, you have won the internets." - Keith Barrow
I concur. I have read the "other book that shall not be named" and found it hard going in it's attempt to cover too much in too academic a style - and having been a professor of Computer Science for a while I know what academic style is all about. I have started reading Marc's book and find it refreshingly clear and obviously written by someone who actually does programming for living and isn't just interested in testing alone. My vote (post actual reading of both works) is that Marc's book is better for most people. I am now, and have been for over thirty years, a professional programmer. I have also been a professor and an author myself, so I have some claims to know a bit about it.
- I would love to change the world, but they won’t give me the source code.
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Karthik. A wrote:
Off late I've fallen in love w/ unit tests
You should try a real girlfriend some time... ;P
Anything that is unrelated to elephants is irrelephant
Anonymous
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Do not argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience
Greg King
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I had the right to remain silent, but I didn't have the ability!
Ron White, ComedianUnit Tests is the name of the attractive blonde three desks over from him.
I was brought up to respect my elders. I don't respect many people nowadays.
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier -
Karthik. A wrote:
Off late I've fallen in love w/ unit tests
You should try a real girlfriend some time... ;P
Anything that is unrelated to elephants is irrelephant
Anonymous
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Do not argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience
Greg King
-----
I had the right to remain silent, but I didn't have the ability!
Ron White, Comedian -
Unit Tests is the name of the attractive blonde three desks over from him.
I was brought up to respect my elders. I don't respect many people nowadays.
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier -
Unit Tests is the name of the attractive blonde three desks over from him.
I was brought up to respect my elders. I don't respect many people nowadays.
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easierLOL - as long as her name isn't Clamydia. :laugh: WTF: Reminds me of a song with Groucho Marx?!?!? :doh:
Anything that is unrelated to elephants is irrelephant
Anonymous
-----
Do not argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience
Greg King
-----
I had the right to remain silent, but I didn't have the ability!
Ron White, Comedian -
[toot toot] Woohoo! If you want a refreshing view of unit testing (would you expect anything else, hahaha) download Unit Testing Succinctly[^]. [/toot toot] Incidentally, I quite enjoyed working with SyncFusion - they paid decently for the book, did some great editing, and the entire experience was very pleasant. Marc
Testers Wanted!
Latest Article: User Authentication on Ruby on Rails - the definitive how to
My BlogExcellent work!
A guide to posting questions on CodeProject[^]
Dave Kreskowiak -
I concur. I have read the "other book that shall not be named" and found it hard going in it's attempt to cover too much in too academic a style - and having been a professor of Computer Science for a while I know what academic style is all about. I have started reading Marc's book and find it refreshingly clear and obviously written by someone who actually does programming for living and isn't just interested in testing alone. My vote (post actual reading of both works) is that Marc's book is better for most people. I am now, and have been for over thirty years, a professional programmer. I have also been a professor and an author myself, so I have some claims to know a bit about it.
- I would love to change the world, but they won’t give me the source code.
If I was half as good as Marc, I'd be very happy. In fact I'd be Ma Clif.
Reality is an illusion caused by a lack of alcohol "Nagy, you have won the internets." - Keith Barrow
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[toot toot] Woohoo! If you want a refreshing view of unit testing (would you expect anything else, hahaha) download Unit Testing Succinctly[^]. [/toot toot] Incidentally, I quite enjoyed working with SyncFusion - they paid decently for the book, did some great editing, and the entire experience was very pleasant. Marc
Testers Wanted!
Latest Article: User Authentication on Ruby on Rails - the definitive how to
My Blog -
Nagy Vilmos wrote:
this kind of document may be harmful to my computer.
It's a PDF, :laugh:
Nagy Vilmos wrote:
Just shows that testing really does sucketh.
Well, given how sucky Chrome has gotten, I definitely think they could use some improved test processes! Marc
Testers Wanted!
Latest Article: User Authentication on Ruby on Rails - the definitive how to
My BlogActually, allowing for Adobe's penchant for leaving gaping security holes in Flash and Acrobat, it seems quite reasonable to me. I avoid both unless from trusted sources. PS. Congrats on the book
"If you don't fail at least 90 percent of the time, you're not aiming high enough." Alan Kay.
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Mocking and Stubbing are the basics one has to understand while doing unit testing. Also it's not about the technology which is really important , it's all the concepts that's really required for one to understand about unit testing. The Art of Unit testing does not target the technology. They have covered the over all things which are really required for developers. I thought it would be better for other developers who want to know more and dig in to the advanced concepts and techniques of Unit Testing. Thanks,
Ranjan.D
I'm afraid you're trying to justify the unjustifiable here. You could have brought this up in a separate thread, but you shoe-horned this into Marc's thread. Plus, you had no possible way of knowing whether or not Marc had talked about mocking and stubbing in the time frame between Marc posting and you hijacking this. I have read the Art of Unit Testing, and I have been reading some of Marc's book - it covers some things thar are missing from AUT; things that elevate it above just being a beginners book. Would you have liked it if you'd written this book and then Marc came along and said "ooh look, there's a better book here instead"?
I was brought up to respect my elders. I don't respect many people nowadays.
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier -
Thanks Pete! (And nice reply to Ranjan, hahaha) Marc
:-D I've got your back.
I was brought up to respect my elders. I don't respect many people nowadays.
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier -
[toot toot] Woohoo! If you want a refreshing view of unit testing (would you expect anything else, hahaha) download Unit Testing Succinctly[^]. [/toot toot] Incidentally, I quite enjoyed working with SyncFusion - they paid decently for the book, did some great editing, and the entire experience was very pleasant. Marc
Testers Wanted!
Latest Article: User Authentication on Ruby on Rails - the definitive how to
My Blog -
[toot toot] Woohoo! If you want a refreshing view of unit testing (would you expect anything else, hahaha) download Unit Testing Succinctly[^]. [/toot toot] Incidentally, I quite enjoyed working with SyncFusion - they paid decently for the book, did some great editing, and the entire experience was very pleasant. Marc
Testers Wanted!
Latest Article: User Authentication on Ruby on Rails - the definitive how to
My Blog -
:-D I've got your back.
I was brought up to respect my elders. I don't respect many people nowadays.
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier -
[toot toot] Woohoo! If you want a refreshing view of unit testing (would you expect anything else, hahaha) download Unit Testing Succinctly[^]. [/toot toot] Incidentally, I quite enjoyed working with SyncFusion - they paid decently for the book, did some great editing, and the entire experience was very pleasant. Marc
Testers Wanted!
Latest Article: User Authentication on Ruby on Rails - the definitive how to
My BlogNice work. I've downloaded it and super-speed read it, and I've learned some stuff. I didn't know you could set up parameters on a test and run the same test repeatedly via multiple attributes, so I've been intellectually enriched. Of course, I never unit test anything I do as it just works perfectly every time but for normal people there's some good stuff in there. :)
Regards, Rob Philpott.
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[toot toot] Woohoo! If you want a refreshing view of unit testing (would you expect anything else, hahaha) download Unit Testing Succinctly[^]. [/toot toot] Incidentally, I quite enjoyed working with SyncFusion - they paid decently for the book, did some great editing, and the entire experience was very pleasant. Marc
Testers Wanted!
Latest Article: User Authentication on Ruby on Rails - the definitive how to
My BlogCongrats!!!
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[toot toot] Woohoo! If you want a refreshing view of unit testing (would you expect anything else, hahaha) download Unit Testing Succinctly[^]. [/toot toot] Incidentally, I quite enjoyed working with SyncFusion - they paid decently for the book, did some great editing, and the entire experience was very pleasant. Marc
Testers Wanted!
Latest Article: User Authentication on Ruby on Rails - the definitive how to
My BlogAnother celebrity in out midst...congrats!
VS2010/Atmel Studio 6.1 ToDo Manager Extension Some days, it's just not worth chewing through the restraints.
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[toot toot] Woohoo! If you want a refreshing view of unit testing (would you expect anything else, hahaha) download Unit Testing Succinctly[^]. [/toot toot] Incidentally, I quite enjoyed working with SyncFusion - they paid decently for the book, did some great editing, and the entire experience was very pleasant. Marc
Testers Wanted!
Latest Article: User Authentication on Ruby on Rails - the definitive how to
My BlogCongrats Marc..:thumbsup:
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[toot toot] Woohoo! If you want a refreshing view of unit testing (would you expect anything else, hahaha) download Unit Testing Succinctly[^]. [/toot toot] Incidentally, I quite enjoyed working with SyncFusion - they paid decently for the book, did some great editing, and the entire experience was very pleasant. Marc
Testers Wanted!
Latest Article: User Authentication on Ruby on Rails - the definitive how to
My Blog:-D I definitely would cast my ONE vote that everyONE should read this book at least ONE time. Nice work, Mark. :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup: =============== Odd, the "About the Author" section seems to be missing the credit line that the Author doesn't personally know me... ;P
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[toot toot] Woohoo! If you want a refreshing view of unit testing (would you expect anything else, hahaha) download Unit Testing Succinctly[^]. [/toot toot] Incidentally, I quite enjoyed working with SyncFusion - they paid decently for the book, did some great editing, and the entire experience was very pleasant. Marc
Testers Wanted!
Latest Article: User Authentication on Ruby on Rails - the definitive how to
My BlogNice work, Mark. :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup: If I may... In my years with Apple's Integration Quality (IQ) Department, Unit (or "Component") Matrix Testing (UMT) was pivitol. IQ ensured all Apple Products were ready for Golden Master / ship status. Of dismay, some products at the time shipped sub-standard. (Not to brag ... OK, bragging ~ the product I was in charge of quality for, the Apple ColorOne Scanner, received the highest QA rating in Apple's then-history from independent testing labs!) I'm jazzed that the first headline in the book, other than "Chapter 1 Why Unit Test?" is "Measuring Correctness". That's the problem allot of testing has, that of the inability to to accurately measure correctness, especially in Unit Matrix Testing (UMT). We had reasonable solo Unit Testing, but there was an absence of measuring cross-unit correctness. That is, we'd measure units A, B & C and say "yup, it's all working", but we didn't measure A & B or A & C as a larger, or "complex"/matrix unit (that UMT noted earlier). OK, yes, with only 3 units we would measure across the matrix, but when it got beyond, say, 10 units, some products would have the next two headline of "Repetition, Repetition, Repetition" and "Code Coverage" skipped for sake of simplifying the overall process. Not good. Especially when a defect is manifested which results in a then $2.4 million ($5.06 million today) "fix-it" cost This actually did occur because a then-Product Manager chose to not include a critical UMT section I had wrote that revealed a defect in a related sister product and would've revealed such in their product; but shipped with the defect. UMT does, in and of itself, (if I may borrow from the book...) introduce cyclomatic unit complexity; a fancy way of saying that the individual units now have multiple points of interaction and integration. Testing instructions: Press the blue button, but first press the orange button. Button Blue and button Orange are units, doing something in and of themselves. When pressed independently, we have the basic raw solo unit test. When executed (pressed) in tandem or consecutively, these buttons (units) present the necessity of UMT, or "integration" testing (hence, the aforementioned QA dept. name of "Integration Quality"). Of course, it may not always be that they would be pressed in tandem or consecutive. Yet, without testing that integration outcome, we fail to "Measure [true] Correctness" and reveal potential defects
