Seriously?
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:wtf: First of all, quality of education now a days is in serious question here and then the self Interest in the topic really matters. Have seen so many people who have learned programming without even going to a technical univeristy.
___@sHubHa
Suvendu Shekhar Giri wrote:
Have seen so many people who have learned programming without even going to a technical univeristy.
But sadly, they won't always get the same job or the same salary as one with the degree, even one so incompetent as the one quoted. :sigh: :sigh:
M.D.V. ;) If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about? Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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Quote from QA:
I have graduated from college with a bachelor’s degree in computer science, however I feel like I don’t have the required skills or knowledge to say that I’m in a intermediate level of java. ... My main programming language is Java, Here is an example of what im kind of trying to find out: -knowledge on how to make variables -understands OOP -knows how to make different loops
:wtf:
Yes, seriously. Also not an incident, and prolly payed a lot to learn "all that". If degrees were so reliable then we wouldn't need a coding-challenge during an interview. So if I can get a degree I'll politely decline again.
Bastard Programmer from Hell :suss: If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^][](X-Clacks-Overhead: GNU Terry Pratchett)
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Quote from QA:
-knowledge on how to make variables -knows how to make different loops
Pretty sure we covered this in the first couple weeks of first semester... What did this guy do for the other 3.9 years of his degree program...? :wtf:
The United States invariably does the right thing, after having exhausted every other alternative. -Winston Churchill America is the only country that went from barbarism to decadence without civilization in between. -Oscar Wilde Wow, even the French showed a little more spine than that before they got their sh*t pushed in.[^] -Colin Mullikin
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People like that are exactly why our interview process has some basic code slinging. Yep, you can talk the walk but we are going to need to see you at least walk a bit (however trivial) just to be sure. Been bitten a couple times and it is such a simple thing to add to the interview process.
Computers have been intelligent for a long time now. It just so happens that the program writers are about as effective as a room full of monkeys trying to crank out a copy of Hamlet. The interesting thing about software is it can not reproduce, until it can.
I agree :thumbsup:. I've held about 20 or 30 interviews over the past few years. My top tip is to focus on what the candidates hobbies are. If they don't include 'programming', 'running my own website', 'learning about coding', etc. then they can't be too serious about progamming for a living. If you want a well paid job in programming, be prepared to have no social life for many years. :-\
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Suvendu Shekhar Giri wrote:
Have seen so many people who have learned programming without even going to a technical univeristy.
But sadly, they won't always get the same job or the same salary as one with the degree, even one so incompetent as the one quoted. :sigh: :sigh:
M.D.V. ;) If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about? Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
True :(
___@sHubHa
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I agree :thumbsup:. I've held about 20 or 30 interviews over the past few years. My top tip is to focus on what the candidates hobbies are. If they don't include 'programming', 'running my own website', 'learning about coding', etc. then they can't be too serious about progamming for a living. If you want a well paid job in programming, be prepared to have no social life for many years. :-\
programify wrote:
My top tip is to focus on what the candidates hobbies are. If they don't include 'programming', 'running my own website', 'learning about coding', etc. then they can't be too serious about progamming for a living.
My hobbies are my car, my dogs, sitting on the couch doing nothing, and sometimes writing a little code at home. Yeah, I have a web page but it only serves static pages and the most impressive thing on it is the rolling patriotic quote that changes every time you somehow refresh the page. It's been three years since I made any substantive change to it.
programify wrote:
If you want a well paid job in programming, be prepared to have no social life for many years.
Been there, done that, and after 35 years of writing code, I'm no longer interested in 20 hour work days. I put in 8 hours and get my work done. If it's a true emergency, I'll stay as long as necessary after my official quitting time. But that doesn't happen very often. Oh yeah, I'm at the point where I've forgotten more programming stuff than a lot of people know. I learn what I need to, but I'm of the belief that the old ways are generally the best ways.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013 -
Quote from QA:
I have graduated from college with a bachelor’s degree in computer science, however I feel like I don’t have the required skills or knowledge to say that I’m in a intermediate level of java. ... My main programming language is Java, Here is an example of what im kind of trying to find out: -knowledge on how to make variables -understands OOP -knows how to make different loops
:wtf:
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Suvendu Shekhar Giri wrote:
Have seen so many people who have learned programming without even going to a technical univeristy.
But sadly, they won't always get the same job or the same salary as one with the degree, even one so incompetent as the one quoted. :sigh: :sigh:
M.D.V. ;) If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about? Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
It helps a lot to have a good science type degree, especially in some kind of engineering, physics, or chemistry. I got my chemistry degree and worked 13 years in the lab, but always programmed on my own as a hobby. Got into programming professionally when the job market bottomed out for chemists in the 90's. All of the companies that I interviewed for had the mindset of "Oh, you have a chemistry degree. You must be smart enough to do this job." I still had to code in the interviews, but much better than not having a degree at all.
When you are dead, you won't even know that you are dead. It's a pain only felt by others. Same thing when you are stupid.
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OriginalGriff wrote:
It's depressing how many people - at least in QA - appear to be trying to get degrees and hold down jobs afterwards....
Read another time... :doh: :doh: :doh: :sigh: :sigh: :sigh: :sigh: X| X| X| X| X| X| X| X| X| X| X| :laugh:
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
That was not a problem of reading, that was a problem about understanding ;P ;) :rolleyes: BTW, the doh's, sigh's and unwell's were for the quoted guy, not for you :cool:
M.D.V. ;) If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about? Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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But isn't that the case with most java programmers anyway?
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013What made me laugh is that a bunch of guys at a company I used to work at had to take a Java course/exam. Some of them were C programmers, and some of them Java programmers. With no exception at all, the C guys scored A Lot higher than the Java guys.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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I suppose that it is just barely possible that in some godforsaken corner of the Earth where they still think that digital wristwatches are a new idea there is a CS course that only teaches abstractions such as algorithms, data structures, and complexity theory. ...Naaaah!
If you have an important point to make, don't try to be subtle or clever. Use a pile driver. Hit the point once. Then come back and hit it again. Then hit it a third time - a tremendous whack. --Winston Churchill
Don't forget the three courses on communication skills and the five on outdated project-management methods. Add that to your "all about abstraction because none of the lecturers knows a tinker's cuss about programming" courses. and you're left with maybe a week-and-a-half of actual programming, distributed an hour at a time over the four years.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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Quote from QA:
I have graduated from college with a bachelor’s degree in computer science, however I feel like I don’t have the required skills or knowledge to say that I’m in a intermediate level of java. ... My main programming language is Java, Here is an example of what im kind of trying to find out: -knowledge on how to make variables -understands OOP -knows how to make different loops
:wtf:
I have only three times hired developers straight from university, and all three times I bitterly regretted it.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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I agree :thumbsup:. I've held about 20 or 30 interviews over the past few years. My top tip is to focus on what the candidates hobbies are. If they don't include 'programming', 'running my own website', 'learning about coding', etc. then they can't be too serious about progamming for a living. If you want a well paid job in programming, be prepared to have no social life for many years. :-\
I have to tell you that I find your "preferences" questionable, and would ask you to re-assess them. From what I have seen, there are no such simple "attributes" that tell you if a guy will do a brilliant job or a bad one; it's more a case of seeing what frightens them and gets them interested.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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programify wrote:
My top tip is to focus on what the candidates hobbies are. If they don't include 'programming', 'running my own website', 'learning about coding', etc. then they can't be too serious about progamming for a living.
My hobbies are my car, my dogs, sitting on the couch doing nothing, and sometimes writing a little code at home. Yeah, I have a web page but it only serves static pages and the most impressive thing on it is the rolling patriotic quote that changes every time you somehow refresh the page. It's been three years since I made any substantive change to it.
programify wrote:
If you want a well paid job in programming, be prepared to have no social life for many years.
Been there, done that, and after 35 years of writing code, I'm no longer interested in 20 hour work days. I put in 8 hours and get my work done. If it's a true emergency, I'll stay as long as necessary after my official quitting time. But that doesn't happen very often. Oh yeah, I'm at the point where I've forgotten more programming stuff than a lot of people know. I learn what I need to, but I'm of the belief that the old ways are generally the best ways.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
-----
You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
-----
When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013Bang on. Well said.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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Quote:
in the first couple weeks
I think I covered this on day one. By day two we were on to more complex things like if-then-else!
- I would love to change the world, but they won’t give me the source code.
It shouldn't even need to be covered. If someone who applies for such a course doesn't already know that much, they should transfer to home ec.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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It shouldn't even need to be covered. If someone who applies for such a course doesn't already know that much, they should transfer to home ec.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
Maybe, but back then there were no home computers - this was all mainframe! I worked part-time at the college computer centre to supplement my partygrant money and had to wear a white coat!
- I would love to change the world, but they won’t give me the source code.
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It shouldn't even need to be covered. If someone who applies for such a course doesn't already know that much, they should transfer to home ec.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
Maybe, but back then there were no home computers - this was all mainframe! I worked part-time at the college computer centre to supplement my partygrant money and had to wear a white coat! :-D
- I would love to change the world, but they won’t give me the source code.
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Maybe, but back then there were no home computers - this was all mainframe! I worked part-time at the college computer centre to supplement my partygrant money and had to wear a white coat!
- I would love to change the world, but they won’t give me the source code.
OH, I loved having to wear the white coat! Dev work sucks, these days :sigh:
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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I agree :thumbsup:. I've held about 20 or 30 interviews over the past few years. My top tip is to focus on what the candidates hobbies are. If they don't include 'programming', 'running my own website', 'learning about coding', etc. then they can't be too serious about progamming for a living. If you want a well paid job in programming, be prepared to have no social life for many years. :-\
programify wrote:
then they can't be too serious about progamming for a living.
Nice top tip you've got there. :rolleyes: ( @chris-maunder : any update on that sarcasm emoticon?) My top tip is that someone who can't spell programming correctly can't possibly be too serious about doing it for a living.
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Quote from QA:
I have graduated from college with a bachelor’s degree in computer science, however I feel like I don’t have the required skills or knowledge to say that I’m in a intermediate level of java. ... My main programming language is Java, Here is an example of what im kind of trying to find out: -knowledge on how to make variables -understands OOP -knows how to make different loops
:wtf:
I studied computer science but it was so fast paced it was hard to learn ins and outs of any programming languages being taught. I had to do 8 subjects per semester and there were lot of non programming subjects from civil engineering , electrical engineering , mathematics etc. I had to go through 4 written exams in 6 month semester and there is no break between each subject exam. When I finished my degree I hardly had any experience that I can use in real world. I had to teach myself most of what I know. University helped me understand the fact that there is no option to hard work and there is always solution you just have to think like an engineer.
Zen and the art of software maintenance : rm -rf * Maths is like love : a simple idea but it can get complicated.
