Debate : Standard v Phillips (Allen, Torx)
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IBM used to outlaw Phillips head screws. There could be many reasons, but Phillips head screws are very easy to strip. Also, there are screw starters for slotted screws, but none that I know of for Phillips. Torx is the only kind I really like. P.S. I'll have to check out the Robertson. I forgot to mention that it is easy to fashion a square head screw driver with a file and almost any piece of metal.
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Here's the question up for debate:
Debate
Why would any modern product use a standard (aka flat head) screw, which requires a standard (flat head) screw driver?
Standard screws are far more difficult to use in a modern era where we have power screw drivers which spin at high RPMs. If you've ever tried this you know that a standard (or slotted screw) will quickly get off balance with each rotation which really creates a challenge. The very least that should be substituted would be the Phillips (+) type. It's much more balanced. I can see using a allen type or Torx or whatever but I just can't understand why slotted would still be used. Why are slotted screws still being produced? In my thinking they should outlaw them to save the sanity anyone who owns a toolbox. :) How many billions $$$ could be saved by such a change? :rolleyes: Counterpoint? Anyone with a counterpoint on why slotted is still valid?
Slot head screws are easier to take out when you don't have your toolbox with you. You can use the dumb little screwdriver head of your swiss army knife. You can use a nail file. You can use a kitchen knife. You can use a dime. Slot head screws are put there for people who don't spend a lot of time taking things apart.
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Here's the question up for debate:
Debate
Why would any modern product use a standard (aka flat head) screw, which requires a standard (flat head) screw driver?
Standard screws are far more difficult to use in a modern era where we have power screw drivers which spin at high RPMs. If you've ever tried this you know that a standard (or slotted screw) will quickly get off balance with each rotation which really creates a challenge. The very least that should be substituted would be the Phillips (+) type. It's much more balanced. I can see using a allen type or Torx or whatever but I just can't understand why slotted would still be used. Why are slotted screws still being produced? In my thinking they should outlaw them to save the sanity anyone who owns a toolbox. :) How many billions $$$ could be saved by such a change? :rolleyes: Counterpoint? Anyone with a counterpoint on why slotted is still valid?
One more note, based upon your "billions $$$ could be saved". A few flat blade screw drivers will fit pretty much anything you find. A little less so with phillps, but somewhat viable. There are hybrid screws, as well, which take both flat blade and phillips. For hex and torx? Another one for each and every size? I think "billions $$$ spent" would be more like it.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
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Bruce Patin wrote:
it is easy to fashion a square head screw driver with a file and almost any piece of metal.
:thumbsup: That's a really great point.
As long as we've touched the waters of "in a pinch", I needed a small screwdriver to fix my glasses. Not anything around . . . wait . . . a paper clip and a rock (hammer, etc.). Bang bang. Now we have a micro flat-blade screwdriver!
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
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Here's the question up for debate:
Debate
Why would any modern product use a standard (aka flat head) screw, which requires a standard (flat head) screw driver?
Standard screws are far more difficult to use in a modern era where we have power screw drivers which spin at high RPMs. If you've ever tried this you know that a standard (or slotted screw) will quickly get off balance with each rotation which really creates a challenge. The very least that should be substituted would be the Phillips (+) type. It's much more balanced. I can see using a allen type or Torx or whatever but I just can't understand why slotted would still be used. Why are slotted screws still being produced? In my thinking they should outlaw them to save the sanity anyone who owns a toolbox. :) How many billions $$$ could be saved by such a change? :rolleyes: Counterpoint? Anyone with a counterpoint on why slotted is still valid?
You have way to much time on your hands.
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One more note, based upon your "billions $$$ could be saved". A few flat blade screw drivers will fit pretty much anything you find. A little less so with phillps, but somewhat viable. There are hybrid screws, as well, which take both flat blade and phillips. For hex and torx? Another one for each and every size? I think "billions $$$ spent" would be more like it.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
W∴ Balboos wrote:
I think "billions $$$ spent" would be more like it.
Hmmm....I've created an industry. :rolleyes: Seriously though, I can agree with what you are saying. That's why The World must agree upon one standard immediately and outlaw all other types. :laugh:
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As long as we've touched the waters of "in a pinch", I needed a small screwdriver to fix my glasses. Not anything around . . . wait . . . a paper clip and a rock (hammer, etc.). Bang bang. Now we have a micro flat-blade screwdriver!
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
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W∴ Balboos wrote:
I think "billions $$$ spent" would be more like it.
Hmmm....I've created an industry. :rolleyes: Seriously though, I can agree with what you are saying. That's why The World must agree upon one standard immediately and outlaw all other types. :laugh:
raddevus wrote:
That's why The World must agree upon one standard immediately and outlaw all other types.
Step One: "Reeducate those good-for-nothing lefties" who'd want to screw around with the direction in which we turn the screws.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
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You have way to much time on your hands.
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raddevus wrote:
That's why The World must agree upon one standard immediately and outlaw all other types.
Step One: "Reeducate those good-for-nothing lefties" who'd want to screw around with the direction in which we turn the screws.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
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W∴ Balboos wrote:
who'd want to screw around with the direction in which we turn the screws.
Can you imagine...
Ridiculous!
Lefty tighty, righty loosey
:rolleyes: It's righty tighty for a reason! :laugh:
Righty Tighty - Lefty Lucy ? I always thought that was referring which direction in bed to face when deciding on which new girlfriend you'll . . .
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
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Here's the question up for debate:
Debate
Why would any modern product use a standard (aka flat head) screw, which requires a standard (flat head) screw driver?
Standard screws are far more difficult to use in a modern era where we have power screw drivers which spin at high RPMs. If you've ever tried this you know that a standard (or slotted screw) will quickly get off balance with each rotation which really creates a challenge. The very least that should be substituted would be the Phillips (+) type. It's much more balanced. I can see using a allen type or Torx or whatever but I just can't understand why slotted would still be used. Why are slotted screws still being produced? In my thinking they should outlaw them to save the sanity anyone who owns a toolbox. :) How many billions $$$ could be saved by such a change? :rolleyes: Counterpoint? Anyone with a counterpoint on why slotted is still valid?
A better question is, why hasn't everyone adopted Robertson. Superior to both; invented in Canada; apparently "banned" in the US; something to do with "not invented in the US" I think.
"(I) am amazed to see myself here rather than there ... now rather than then". ― Blaise Pascal
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Here's the question up for debate:
Debate
Why would any modern product use a standard (aka flat head) screw, which requires a standard (flat head) screw driver?
Standard screws are far more difficult to use in a modern era where we have power screw drivers which spin at high RPMs. If you've ever tried this you know that a standard (or slotted screw) will quickly get off balance with each rotation which really creates a challenge. The very least that should be substituted would be the Phillips (+) type. It's much more balanced. I can see using a allen type or Torx or whatever but I just can't understand why slotted would still be used. Why are slotted screws still being produced? In my thinking they should outlaw them to save the sanity anyone who owns a toolbox. :) How many billions $$$ could be saved by such a change? :rolleyes: Counterpoint? Anyone with a counterpoint on why slotted is still valid?
Notice that all the screws in a mechanical wristwatch are slotted. There is a reason for this. The original Phillips driver was designed for building aluminum aircraft. It was designed to cam out before the material being screwed into was damaged. Later cross-drive screws, e.g., frearson, were mostly not designed to cam out. As others have said, with cross-drive screw heads the bit is self-centering. It isn't with slotted screw heads, but the slot is easily restored. If you ruin a cross drive head you need a screw extractor. All the above are much inferior to Torx.
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These things must be considered! :laugh: And, I'd have more if The World would standardize on one screw type. :rolleyes:
A plain-old bread-knife can replace a flathead or slotted screwdriver in a pinch, therefore making as the standard, in my opinion.
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OriginalGriff wrote:
Do you mean "Phillips", or "Posidrive"?
I knew whatever I called phillips and slotted that someone would mention some other name. I did my best to look it up but it seems a lot of people refer to them as phillips. This is a good article / video: Quick Tip: Know Your Screwdrivers (Hint: It's Not a "Flathead!") | Make:[^]
Pozidriv is not just another name, it is a very different head compared to Phillips. You cannot use a Pozidriv bit on a Phillips head and a Phillips bit on a Pozidriv screw very easily starts stripping. Sometimes wikipedia is the way to go... List of screw drives - Wikipedia[^]
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Here's the question up for debate:
Debate
Why would any modern product use a standard (aka flat head) screw, which requires a standard (flat head) screw driver?
Standard screws are far more difficult to use in a modern era where we have power screw drivers which spin at high RPMs. If you've ever tried this you know that a standard (or slotted screw) will quickly get off balance with each rotation which really creates a challenge. The very least that should be substituted would be the Phillips (+) type. It's much more balanced. I can see using a allen type or Torx or whatever but I just can't understand why slotted would still be used. Why are slotted screws still being produced? In my thinking they should outlaw them to save the sanity anyone who owns a toolbox. :) How many billions $$$ could be saved by such a change? :rolleyes: Counterpoint? Anyone with a counterpoint on why slotted is still valid?
My main thought is that for every other type of screw, you need EXACTLY the correct size of screwdriver. So, for a general life, you need 6-8 sizes of Phillips, 8-10 of Torx, 4-6 of Robertson, but you can by with about three flat blade screwdrivers (small, medium, large). Specifically, in electronics, NO, I can think of no reason for a standard screw.
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Notice that all the screws in a mechanical wristwatch are slotted. There is a reason for this. The original Phillips driver was designed for building aluminum aircraft. It was designed to cam out before the material being screwed into was damaged. Later cross-drive screws, e.g., frearson, were mostly not designed to cam out. As others have said, with cross-drive screw heads the bit is self-centering. It isn't with slotted screw heads, but the slot is easily restored. If you ruin a cross drive head you need a screw extractor. All the above are much inferior to Torx.
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My main thought is that for every other type of screw, you need EXACTLY the correct size of screwdriver. So, for a general life, you need 6-8 sizes of Phillips, 8-10 of Torx, 4-6 of Robertson, but you can by with about three flat blade screwdrivers (small, medium, large). Specifically, in electronics, NO, I can think of no reason for a standard screw.
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Here's the question up for debate:
Debate
Why would any modern product use a standard (aka flat head) screw, which requires a standard (flat head) screw driver?
Standard screws are far more difficult to use in a modern era where we have power screw drivers which spin at high RPMs. If you've ever tried this you know that a standard (or slotted screw) will quickly get off balance with each rotation which really creates a challenge. The very least that should be substituted would be the Phillips (+) type. It's much more balanced. I can see using a allen type or Torx or whatever but I just can't understand why slotted would still be used. Why are slotted screws still being produced? In my thinking they should outlaw them to save the sanity anyone who owns a toolbox. :) How many billions $$$ could be saved by such a change? :rolleyes: Counterpoint? Anyone with a counterpoint on why slotted is still valid?
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A plain-old bread-knife can replace a flathead or slotted screwdriver in a pinch, therefore making as the standard, in my opinion.