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  3. What happened to engineering?

What happened to engineering?

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  • Kornfeld Eliyahu PeterK Kornfeld Eliyahu Peter

    Be patient - these are all AI aided devices... With time they will learn and improve...

    "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge". Stephen Hawking, 1942- 2018

    P Offline
    P Offline
    PIEBALDconsult
    wrote on last edited by
    #9

    Then retire to the Caribbean.

    1 Reply Last reply
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    • CPalliniC CPallini

      Not software engineering, the real one. Software engineering used to compare with the latter like astrology compares with astrophysics. But now? In my bitter experience, many brand new products doesn't work properly from the very start. I'll name few examples: a GPS watch, a blood pressure monitor, a TV soundbar, even a vacuum cleaner. On the other side, my Windows 8 never crashes, seldom hangs. Are engineers, collectively, on sabbatic leave?

      J Offline
      J Offline
      Jorgen Andersson
      wrote on last edited by
      #10

      Always check the quality stamp before buying. It starts with: "Made in..."

      Wrong is evil and must be defeated. - Jeff Ello

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      • J Jorgen Andersson

        Always check the quality stamp before buying. It starts with: "Made in..."

        Wrong is evil and must be defeated. - Jeff Ello

        L Offline
        L Offline
        Lost User
        wrote on last edited by
        #11

        don't be so harsh, you know there are some quality goods out of china, but out the back door of the same factory are all the below/failed spec "same same, we only change name" versions of the identical product. (they can do quality, just that their pass yields are still not good.)

        Message Signature (Click to edit ->)

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        • OriginalGriffO OriginalGriff

          I kinda know what you mean, but ... my suspicion is that it's the "software engineering" side of new devices that lets down the hardware engineer side. A sous vide I bought, with WiFi and BlueTooth. That works wonderfully, if you ignore the WiFi and bluetooth (and definitely the app that comes with it) I don't own a GPS watch, or even a smart watch: mine has hands, is made of titanium, and was a gift last century! Vacuum cleaners ... blame the EU, I do. I have a "old" 2200W mains machine which works, even on cat hair. Modern ones ... the EU cut the max power in two stages to 900W and they suck. In both senses. They are rechargeable mostly because the manufacturers needed to find something to sell them on, since "actually cleaning" was no longer an option.

          Sent from my Amstrad PC 1640 Never throw anything away, Griff Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay... AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!

          J Offline
          J Offline
          Jorgen Andersson
          wrote on last edited by
          #12

          It really isn't so much about the power as you might think. It's all about air flow. It's a bit like with amplifiers. Twice the power only gives 3db more sound And modern vacuums simply are to small to have a proper airflow. If you have the space you should buy one of these[^]. They never were more than 1000w but they will last you your lifetime.

          Wrong is evil and must be defeated. - Jeff Ello

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          • L Lost User

            don't be so harsh, you know there are some quality goods out of china, but out the back door of the same factory are all the below/failed spec "same same, we only change name" versions of the identical product. (they can do quality, just that their pass yields are still not good.)

            Message Signature (Click to edit ->)

            J Offline
            J Offline
            Jorgen Andersson
            wrote on last edited by
            #13

            You're the one that filled in the dots. :) But generally it's a question about getting what you pay for.

            Wrong is evil and must be defeated. - Jeff Ello

            CPalliniC 1 Reply Last reply
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            • J Jorgen Andersson

              You're the one that filled in the dots. :) But generally it's a question about getting what you pay for.

              Wrong is evil and must be defeated. - Jeff Ello

              CPalliniC Offline
              CPalliniC Offline
              CPallini
              wrote on last edited by
              #14

              Not in my experience. The Garmin forerunner 310xt for instance, it is a very precise device. I've extensively tested it (my running companion since 2012). The Garmin fenix 5 (far more expensive than the forerunner) might be a cool smartwatch but is a completely failure for thge runner. The distance mesurment error of 5% I experienced (meaning about 2 km in marathon) is inacceptable.

              In testa che avete, signor di Ceprano?

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              • L Lost User

                Quote:

                "powered by Java

                How many Ampere does Java deliver? :-D

                It does not solve my Problem, but it answers my question

                CPalliniC Offline
                CPalliniC Offline
                CPallini
                wrote on last edited by
                #15

                How many Ampere does Java deliver waste?

                FFY. :-D

                In testa che avete, signor di Ceprano?

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                • CPalliniC CPallini

                  Not in my experience. The Garmin forerunner 310xt for instance, it is a very precise device. I've extensively tested it (my running companion since 2012). The Garmin fenix 5 (far more expensive than the forerunner) might be a cool smartwatch but is a completely failure for thge runner. The distance mesurment error of 5% I experienced (meaning about 2 km in marathon) is inacceptable.

                  J Offline
                  J Offline
                  Jorgen Andersson
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #16

                  Sounds like you're not having it in gps-mode. How long does the batteries last?

                  Wrong is evil and must be defeated. - Jeff Ello

                  CPalliniC 1 Reply Last reply
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                  • J Jorgen Andersson

                    Sounds like you're not having it in gps-mode. How long does the batteries last?

                    Wrong is evil and must be defeated. - Jeff Ello

                    CPalliniC Offline
                    CPalliniC Offline
                    CPallini
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #17

                    Of course the GPS is ON (and 'ready') while I am running. The tracks are actually fairly accurate, but the distance measurment is poor. The batteries performace is within the specifications as far as I can say (I didn't focus my attention on such an aspect, yet).

                    In testa che avete, signor di Ceprano?

                    J 1 Reply Last reply
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                    • CPalliniC CPallini

                      Not software engineering, the real one. Software engineering used to compare with the latter like astrology compares with astrophysics. But now? In my bitter experience, many brand new products doesn't work properly from the very start. I'll name few examples: a GPS watch, a blood pressure monitor, a TV soundbar, even a vacuum cleaner. On the other side, my Windows 8 never crashes, seldom hangs. Are engineers, collectively, on sabbatic leave?

                      M Offline
                      M Offline
                      Marc Clifton
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #18

                      Managers.

                      Latest Article - A Concise Overview of Threads Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802

                      CPalliniC 1 Reply Last reply
                      0
                      • CPalliniC CPallini

                        Of course the GPS is ON (and 'ready') while I am running. The tracks are actually fairly accurate, but the distance measurment is poor. The batteries performace is within the specifications as far as I can say (I didn't focus my attention on such an aspect, yet).

                        J Offline
                        J Offline
                        Jorgen Andersson
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #19

                        Had to ask. A guy at a previous job was running in battery save mode for half a year before realizing why the gps was all over the map. Is i always showing a too large distance by any chance?

                        Wrong is evil and must be defeated. - Jeff Ello

                        CPalliniC 1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • CPalliniC CPallini

                          Not software engineering, the real one. Software engineering used to compare with the latter like astrology compares with astrophysics. But now? In my bitter experience, many brand new products doesn't work properly from the very start. I'll name few examples: a GPS watch, a blood pressure monitor, a TV soundbar, even a vacuum cleaner. On the other side, my Windows 8 never crashes, seldom hangs. Are engineers, collectively, on sabbatic leave?

                          L Offline
                          L Offline
                          Lost User
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #20

                          "Population aging is a shift in the distribution of a country's population towards older ages." (From wikipedia) It will only get worse.

                          Bastard Programmer from Hell :suss: If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^] "If you just follow the bacon Eddy, wherever it leads you, then you won't have to think about politics." -- Some Bell.

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                          • CPalliniC CPallini

                            How many Ampere does Java deliver waste?

                            FFY. :-D

                            P Offline
                            P Offline
                            PIEBALDconsult
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #21

                            I'm more concerned about the time wasted waiting for a DVD or Blu-ray player to boot up, then check for updates, and determine whether or not the licence is valid, then not allow me to press the eject button until it confirms that there's no disc in it... These sorts of things worked just fine before they became infected with Java.

                            CPalliniC 1 Reply Last reply
                            0
                            • J Jorgen Andersson

                              Had to ask. A guy at a previous job was running in battery save mode for half a year before realizing why the gps was all over the map. Is i always showing a too large distance by any chance?

                              Wrong is evil and must be defeated. - Jeff Ello

                              CPalliniC Offline
                              CPalliniC Offline
                              CPallini
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #22

                              On the contrary, as a matter of fact is (almost) always showing a too small one (making the poor runner breathless in order to keep the pace :-) ).

                              In testa che avete, signor di Ceprano?

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              0
                              • P PIEBALDconsult

                                I'm more concerned about the time wasted waiting for a DVD or Blu-ray player to boot up, then check for updates, and determine whether or not the licence is valid, then not allow me to press the eject button until it confirms that there's no disc in it... These sorts of things worked just fine before they became infected with Java.

                                CPalliniC Offline
                                CPalliniC Offline
                                CPallini
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #23

                                :-D It reminds me the infective behaviour of certain antiviruses.

                                In testa che avete, signor di Ceprano?

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                0
                                • OriginalGriffO OriginalGriff

                                  I kinda know what you mean, but ... my suspicion is that it's the "software engineering" side of new devices that lets down the hardware engineer side. A sous vide I bought, with WiFi and BlueTooth. That works wonderfully, if you ignore the WiFi and bluetooth (and definitely the app that comes with it) I don't own a GPS watch, or even a smart watch: mine has hands, is made of titanium, and was a gift last century! Vacuum cleaners ... blame the EU, I do. I have a "old" 2200W mains machine which works, even on cat hair. Modern ones ... the EU cut the max power in two stages to 900W and they suck. In both senses. They are rechargeable mostly because the manufacturers needed to find something to sell them on, since "actually cleaning" was no longer an option.

                                  Sent from my Amstrad PC 1640 Never throw anything away, Griff Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay... AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!

                                  M Offline
                                  M Offline
                                  Martijn Smitshoek
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #24

                                  OriginalGriff wrote:

                                  Vacuum cleaners [...] they suck

                                  You only wish they did. In the near future, they will stop in the middle of cleaning, download a firmware update, and fail to start again because of a licensing issue.

                                  OriginalGriffO 1 Reply Last reply
                                  0
                                  • M Martijn Smitshoek

                                    OriginalGriff wrote:

                                    Vacuum cleaners [...] they suck

                                    You only wish they did. In the near future, they will stop in the middle of cleaning, download a firmware update, and fail to start again because of a licensing issue.

                                    OriginalGriffO Offline
                                    OriginalGriffO Offline
                                    OriginalGriff
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #25

                                    That's OK - I'm used to switching the hoover off and back on again anyway... :laugh:

                                    Sent from my Amstrad PC 1640 Never throw anything away, Griff Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay... AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!

                                    "I have no idea what I did, but I'm taking full credit for it." - ThisOldTony
                                    "Common sense is so rare these days, it should be classified as a super power" - Random T-shirt

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    0
                                    • CPalliniC CPallini

                                      Not software engineering, the real one. Software engineering used to compare with the latter like astrology compares with astrophysics. But now? In my bitter experience, many brand new products doesn't work properly from the very start. I'll name few examples: a GPS watch, a blood pressure monitor, a TV soundbar, even a vacuum cleaner. On the other side, my Windows 8 never crashes, seldom hangs. Are engineers, collectively, on sabbatic leave?

                                      M Offline
                                      M Offline
                                      Munchies_Matt
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #26

                                      Most people in software arent engineers, they are nerds.

                                      M 1 Reply Last reply
                                      0
                                      • M Marc Clifton

                                        Managers.

                                        Latest Article - A Concise Overview of Threads Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802

                                        CPalliniC Offline
                                        CPalliniC Offline
                                        CPallini
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #27

                                        That could be.

                                        In testa che avete, signor di Ceprano?

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        0
                                        • J Jorgen Andersson

                                          It really isn't so much about the power as you might think. It's all about air flow. It's a bit like with amplifiers. Twice the power only gives 3db more sound And modern vacuums simply are to small to have a proper airflow. If you have the space you should buy one of these[^]. They never were more than 1000w but they will last you your lifetime.

                                          Wrong is evil and must be defeated. - Jeff Ello

                                          H Offline
                                          H Offline
                                          haughtonomous
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #28

                                          "Twice the power only gives 3db more sound"... That's a bit misleading. Twice the power gives twice the 'sound'. Sound pressure level has a logarithmic scale of measurement where +3db is a multiplying factor of 2. A logarithmic scale of measurement is used because the human ear is also logarithmic, automatically compensating for increases in sound pressure level so the perceived increase in loudness isn't linear. An increase of 3db is a doubling of the SPL. It's twice as loud, although to the brain doesn't seem so, but that's a physiological phenomenon.

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