There is generally a lot of truth in jokes
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Sander Rossel wrote:
Because you can't raise children when you're not married?
Obviously not.
Sander Rossel wrote:
You can live together and do all the things you'd do when you were married without actually being married.
That is a true statement.
Social Media - A platform that makes it easier for the crazies to find each other. Everyone is born right handed. Only the strongest overcome it. Fight for left-handed rights and hand equality.
ZurdoDev wrote:
Obviously not.
I can't tell if you're joking or being serious :^) I'd assume you're joking, but we've proven to have completely different viewpoints and beliefs that aren't always compatible before :laugh:
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
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Yeah, and since it's ONLY a contract (to me at least), it's absurd so many people are against same sex marriage. That's because to those people it's more, it's some holy ritual that ultimately changes nothing to your current reality. I get the contract, but beyond that I'm at a loss.
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
I forgot to mention, here where I live: Church and state marriages are strictly separated and for legal aspects only state marriages/contracts count. And therefore also gender is no issue for a state marriage.
It does not solve my Problem, but it answers my question
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ZurdoDev wrote:
Obviously not.
I can't tell if you're joking or being serious :^) I'd assume you're joking, but we've proven to have completely different viewpoints and beliefs that aren't always compatible before :laugh:
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
You implied that I had said you can't raise children unless you're married. I'm shocked you would think I'd say something like that or that ANYONE would say something like that. Of course you can raise children even if you're not married. I don't think you read my post very clearly.
Social Media - A platform that makes it easier for the crazies to find each other. Everyone is born right handed. Only the strongest overcome it. Fight for left-handed rights and hand equality.
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I forgot to mention, here where I live: Church and state marriages are strictly separated and for legal aspects only state marriages/contracts count. And therefore also gender is no issue for a state marriage.
It does not solve my Problem, but it answers my question
0x01AA wrote:
And therefore also gender is no issue for a state marriage.
Not officially anyway ;) I think The Netherlands was the first country to legalize same sex marriage, but only after it was forbidden for centuries(?). They can marry now, but they can also be beaten up because, well, they are attracted to the same sex. It's not legal to beat them up, but it still happens :sigh: I also think civil servants are allowed to refuse a same sex marriage and another civil servant will do it instead. Not sure if that's legal, but I know it happens. I think we have the same system as well, by the way.
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
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You implied that I had said you can't raise children unless you're married. I'm shocked you would think I'd say something like that or that ANYONE would say something like that. Of course you can raise children even if you're not married. I don't think you read my post very clearly.
Social Media - A platform that makes it easier for the crazies to find each other. Everyone is born right handed. Only the strongest overcome it. Fight for left-handed rights and hand equality.
You're right, you said "the best way" and not "the only way". I still don't think it matters whether you're married or not though, but that's another matter :)
ZurdoDev wrote:
I'm shocked you would think I'd say something like that or that ANYONE would say something like that.
I think there are countries where you get jail time or worse when you get kids without being married. You'll at least be forced to marry (even when it's from rape, just to illustrate the seriousness of the matter). And it's not even that long ago that his was also the norm in our countries. Actually, I live in a bible belt where some people still frown upon getting children without being married or even living together without being married.
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
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You're right, you said "the best way" and not "the only way". I still don't think it matters whether you're married or not though, but that's another matter :)
ZurdoDev wrote:
I'm shocked you would think I'd say something like that or that ANYONE would say something like that.
I think there are countries where you get jail time or worse when you get kids without being married. You'll at least be forced to marry (even when it's from rape, just to illustrate the seriousness of the matter). And it's not even that long ago that his was also the norm in our countries. Actually, I live in a bible belt where some people still frown upon getting children without being married or even living together without being married.
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
Sander Rossel wrote:
You're right, you said "the best way" and not "the only way".
Correct.
Sander Rossel wrote:
I still don't think it matters whether you're married or not though
Yes, I know that about you.
Sander Rossel wrote:
I think there are countries where you get jail time or worse when you get kids without being married.
Extremes are rarely a good thing.
Sander Rossel wrote:
where some people still frown upon getting children without being married or even living together without being married.
Luckily, that's not just in the Bible belt. But it is a fading practice, unfortunately.
Social Media - A platform that makes it easier for the crazies to find each other. Everyone is born right handed. Only the strongest overcome it. Fight for left-handed rights and hand equality.
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at least they tend to be more funny when there is. With all of the "marriage sucks" jokes lately (a lot of them by one specific member) it makes me wonder why do people bother getting married? Why do people keep getting married if it's such torture? I've never understood that. Marriage sucks jokes have been around forever yet people keep getting married. If your marriage is like all of these jokes, I suggest you go to counseling. Marriage does not have to be and should not be torture. It should be the best relationship you ever have. I suppose for some of you, maybe it is torture AND the best relationship at the same time. :laugh:
Social Media - A platform that makes it easier for the crazies to find each other. Everyone is born right handed. Only the strongest overcome it. Fight for left-handed rights and hand equality.
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Slacker007 wrote:
there are more cons than pros,
When done right, marriage is the best way to raise children. Religious or not, biological or not, it has been proven to be the best way to raise kids and to stabilize society.
Social Media - A platform that makes it easier for the crazies to find each other. Everyone is born right handed. Only the strongest overcome it. Fight for left-handed rights and hand equality.
ZurdoDev wrote:
marriage is the best way to raise children
agreed. that's a pro.
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You're right, you said "the best way" and not "the only way". I still don't think it matters whether you're married or not though, but that's another matter :)
ZurdoDev wrote:
I'm shocked you would think I'd say something like that or that ANYONE would say something like that.
I think there are countries where you get jail time or worse when you get kids without being married. You'll at least be forced to marry (even when it's from rape, just to illustrate the seriousness of the matter). And it's not even that long ago that his was also the norm in our countries. Actually, I live in a bible belt where some people still frown upon getting children without being married or even living together without being married.
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
Sander Rossel wrote:
You're right, you said "the best way" and not "the only way". I still don't think it matters whether you're married or not though, but that's another matter :)
This is much too complex a subject to be covered in a short post, but I'll try... The problem is that, as the Chinese ideogram for "mother" hints, everyone has a mother. Who the father is, is less certain. :) Shorn of the religious part, traditional (m-f) marriage is an attempt to balance between the obligation of the man to support his children and his fear (in the days before genetic testing) that his wife's children are not his, and that therefore he is supporting some freeloader's children. In marriage, a man agrees to support all children born in the marriage, and the woman agrees that her children will only be sired by the man. OTOH, there was no obligation on the man to support children born out of wedlock. This is one of the reasons why unfaithfulness by the woman was treated much more seriously than unfaithfulness by the man - it consisted possible fraud.
Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows. -- 6079 Smith W.
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Do you get along with your best friend ALL the time? Marriage is like that, you can get out of sorts with your partner but there is enough love and friendship to get past differences and make up. The bond grows stronger through these situations. Been married for 32 years to my best friend and I wouldn't change any of it except for the times I've been an idiot and hurt her.
MarkTJohnson wrote:
I wouldn't change any of it except for the times I've been an idiot and hurt her.
Honest question: Has anyone ever found himself to be a situation where she admitted being the idiot and hurt you? That always seems to be so one-sided. The old joke, and it is one of them, is that it's always the guy who's wrong, no exception. I make mistakes and I'll own up. But it has to go both ways. Otherwise one of the two is pretending, and I refuse to play that game if those are the rules. (says the happily single guy)
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We tend to make jokes about subjects that make us uncomfortable. This is why sex and death are the eternal funny subjects. As for marriage, it involves living in very close proximity to someone whose fundamental thought processes differ from ours. For example, my wife had to figuratively beat me over the head before I realized that when she complained about her day, she wanted sympathy, not solutions. No wonder we tell jokes about it! We've survived 19 years and two teenage girls, so we can't be doing too badly...
Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows. -- 6079 Smith W.
Daniel Pfeffer wrote:
my wife had to figuratively beat me over the head before I realized that when she complained about her day, she wanted sympathy, not solutions
That's so simple, yet tremendously insightful. If I commiserate to somebody else, typically it's because I'm fishing for solutions, as I have very little practical use for sympathy. Whereas if I have a solution, then that means in the future I can proactively work at avoiding altogether whatever got me down in the first place. Wanting sympathy, but not looking for solutions, simply means the situation will be repeating itself. That's the problem-solver in me speaking.
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I wasn't planning on getting married, ever :D It's a weird social construct that adds nothing when you're happy in love, but adds a lot of trouble when that love has gone :laugh: On a side note, I think raising or burning a flag, or a politician apologizing for slavery or WWII or whatever (anything they didn't personally do or had any influence on), a minute of silence and that sort of symbolic statements are all weird social constructs that I really don't get. They're symbolic and change absolutely nothing to what has already passed. Marriage, in that sense, is purely symbolic and does nothing except give you some tax benefits and arrange for your heritage that you could also get from a cohabitation contract.
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
Sander Rossel wrote:
tax benefits
Ding ding ding ding ding!! That's how I've come to view marriage. And considering the risks (more than 50% nowadays end up in divorce), I'd rather continue doing my own thing, thank-you-very-much. And when people tell me that's a sad way to look at things, I say keep that sympathy for those who were taken to the cleaners in a nasty divorce process. I can cite enough examples to make anyone weep.
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Jörgen Andersson wrote:
Depending on where you live it might add a lot of economic and social stability.
Exactly, it's an economic contract. In the Netherlands I believe you can obtain the same with a cohabitation contract. Beyond the economic contract I don't get it. You know, the standard girl's dream, big day, rituals, rings, through sickness and health, blah blah... Until the divorce anyway. In the Netherlands you can get married for free at the city hall on Monday. In, out, always prenub, and have that contract dealt with.
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
Sander Rossel wrote:
You know, the standard girl's dream, big day, rituals, rings, through sickness and health, blah blah... Until the divorce anyway.
I guess that was never my sister's thing. She got married in my folk's backyard in the presence of them, myself, and a priest. And yeah, today she's divorced. Lasted a whole, I think, 6 years. She'd never admit it, but to me it's this simple: She spent 11 years with her first boyfriend, then when it became clear, as she was reaching her mid-30s, that she wasn't ever going to change his mind about not having kids, she got hitched to the first poor SOB who came along, got the kid she wanted, divorced him, he served his purpose, wham, bam, thank you sir, and they're now divorced. I actually feel more sorry for the guy than her, but at least she let him off easy, financially. By all legal rights she could've made his life a whole lot more difficult. Yet another way to convince me I've done the right thing. I want nothing to do with that sort of crap, and I've seen it all but too often.
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0x01AA wrote:
And therefore also gender is no issue for a state marriage.
Not officially anyway ;) I think The Netherlands was the first country to legalize same sex marriage, but only after it was forbidden for centuries(?). They can marry now, but they can also be beaten up because, well, they are attracted to the same sex. It's not legal to beat them up, but it still happens :sigh: I also think civil servants are allowed to refuse a same sex marriage and another civil servant will do it instead. Not sure if that's legal, but I know it happens. I think we have the same system as well, by the way.
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
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Slacker007 wrote:
there are more cons than pros,
When done right, marriage is the best way to raise children. Religious or not, biological or not, it has been proven to be the best way to raise kids and to stabilize society.
Social Media - A platform that makes it easier for the crazies to find each other. Everyone is born right handed. Only the strongest overcome it. Fight for left-handed rights and hand equality.
Evolution would be on your side in this: both parties have a genetic interest in the offspring and survival as a group allows more options (varying as the young mature) for survival of all members of the group.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
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at least they tend to be more funny when there is. With all of the "marriage sucks" jokes lately (a lot of them by one specific member) it makes me wonder why do people bother getting married? Why do people keep getting married if it's such torture? I've never understood that. Marriage sucks jokes have been around forever yet people keep getting married. If your marriage is like all of these jokes, I suggest you go to counseling. Marriage does not have to be and should not be torture. It should be the best relationship you ever have. I suppose for some of you, maybe it is torture AND the best relationship at the same time. :laugh:
Social Media - A platform that makes it easier for the crazies to find each other. Everyone is born right handed. Only the strongest overcome it. Fight for left-handed rights and hand equality.
my $0.02 Caveat: just completed 59 years. Great, if not perfect, life. Would do it again. I think, though, I would have my grandchildren first, they are more fun than children. I think you could add some legal ramifications. Yes, in most, if not all parts of this country, you can coexist without marriage. I told my daughters that doing so could significantly reduce their options if the coexist partner walks out leaving them behind.
If you can keep your head while those about you are losing theirs, perhaps you don't understand the situation.
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my $0.02 Caveat: just completed 59 years. Great, if not perfect, life. Would do it again. I think, though, I would have my grandchildren first, they are more fun than children. I think you could add some legal ramifications. Yes, in most, if not all parts of this country, you can coexist without marriage. I told my daughters that doing so could significantly reduce their options if the coexist partner walks out leaving them behind.
If you can keep your head while those about you are losing theirs, perhaps you don't understand the situation.
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Slacker007 wrote:
there are more cons than pros,
When done right, marriage is the best way to raise children. Religious or not, biological or not, it has been proven to be the best way to raise kids and to stabilize society.
Social Media - A platform that makes it easier for the crazies to find each other. Everyone is born right handed. Only the strongest overcome it. Fight for left-handed rights and hand equality.
ZurdoDev wrote:
the best way to raise children
Don't we have a few billion monkeys too many on this planet already?
ZurdoDev wrote:
stabilize society.
I'm not sure that I want to s(t)abilize it.
I have lived with several Zen masters - all of them were cats. His last invention was an evil Lasagna. It didn't kill anyone, and it actually tasted pretty good.
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Marriage is a religious notion, not biological. Marriage does suck. It has its benefits, but there are more cons than pros, IMHO.
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Slacker007 wrote:
there are more cons than pros,
When done right, marriage is the best way to raise children. Religious or not, biological or not, it has been proven to be the best way to raise kids and to stabilize society.
Social Media - A platform that makes it easier for the crazies to find each other. Everyone is born right handed. Only the strongest overcome it. Fight for left-handed rights and hand equality.
ZurdoDev wrote:
When done right, marriage is the best way to raise children.
Provided that the marriage does not end up in dogfight and a divorce. Not very many couples divorce as friends. Most end up as enemies. Lots of people who have been living together, and after they break up, they are still friends. Most kids want their parents to be friends. A happy, life long marriage could be a good framework for raising children. Statistics tell that this ideal is not the norm. It is just an ideal. Even if marriages are life long, lots of them are not happy. There is this story from the old days when people were riding horses. One old couple who had been married for fifty years, it was said that there had never been any argument or quarrel. The journalist from the local newspaper asked the couple if that was true, and how they had managed to live in harmony for that long. The husband explained: When we were on our way from church after our marriage, something made the horse pulling our wagon stall. I let it calm down, and commented "That was the first time!" We rode on, and then it stalled again. It calmed down, and I commented "That was the second time!" Well, when it stalled for the third time, I didn't say a word but picked up my handgun and gave that horse a bullet in one ear an out the other. That caused my wife of half an hour gave me a really harsh scolding. I didn't reply with a single word until she ran out of breath. Then I commented "That was the first time".
