Introduction to programming?
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No offence intended, but maybe you shouldn't judge people based on two to three lines someone wrote about them on a public forum ;) She spent the last ten years of her life getting to where she is now, doing study after study, and finishing them all with good grades. Next to that, she taught kids and (specifically) immigrants for the past five years or so, because she loved helping and seeing these kids grow. But after this time she decided now is the time to try something new and I have no doubt that if she likes this, she'll go for it and she'll be a (certified) programmer in a few years time. I know few people who are as determined as she is/was.
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
Fair enough, but I still stand by my statement. Spending 10 years to become a primary school teacher is hardly an achievement, most people will do it in 4 years. From my perspective, spending 10 years doing different degrees is definitely a sign of someone who doesn't know what they want to do with their life. I am not saying there is anything wrong with it. She if free to do whatever makes her happy. I am simply pointing out that she appears to get bored easily, and without any long term goals, programming will just be another "stop gap". Anyway just my opinion, of which I am sure she has no care :-D
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Fair enough, but I still stand by my statement. Spending 10 years to become a primary school teacher is hardly an achievement, most people will do it in 4 years. From my perspective, spending 10 years doing different degrees is definitely a sign of someone who doesn't know what they want to do with their life. I am not saying there is anything wrong with it. She if free to do whatever makes her happy. I am simply pointing out that she appears to get bored easily, and without any long term goals, programming will just be another "stop gap". Anyway just my opinion, of which I am sure she has no care :-D
musefan wrote:
Spending 10 years to become a primary school teacher is hardly an achievement
It's a bit more complicated than that :laugh:
musefan wrote:
Anyway just my opinion, of which I am sure she has no care
Your careless words hit her hard and she went from successful teacher to sleeping on a bench in the park, next to a shopping cart full of stuff and looking for food in dumpsters, all in the past hour :sigh: That was sarcasm, just in case you missed it ;p
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
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musefan wrote:
Spending 10 years to become a primary school teacher is hardly an achievement
It's a bit more complicated than that :laugh:
musefan wrote:
Anyway just my opinion, of which I am sure she has no care
Your careless words hit her hard and she went from successful teacher to sleeping on a bench in the park, next to a shopping cart full of stuff and looking for food in dumpsters, all in the past hour :sigh: That was sarcasm, just in case you missed it ;p
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
Sander Rossel wrote:
Your careless words hit her hard...
I change lives, it's just what I do.
Sander Rossel wrote:
That was sarcasm, just in case you missed it
You may be a stranger, Sander, but if there is one thing I know of you it's that you are a rational and logical thinker, with a good sense of humour. Thus, no need to explain your sarcasm :) In fact, the day you respond emotionally will be the day I report your account as being hacked :laugh:
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Sander Rossel wrote:
Your careless words hit her hard...
I change lives, it's just what I do.
Sander Rossel wrote:
That was sarcasm, just in case you missed it
You may be a stranger, Sander, but if there is one thing I know of you it's that you are a rational and logical thinker, with a good sense of humour. Thus, no need to explain your sarcasm :) In fact, the day you respond emotionally will be the day I report your account as being hacked :laugh:
musefan wrote:
You may be a stranger, Sander
I always tell people you're my bestie! :((
musefan wrote:
the day you respond emotionally will be the day I report your account as being hacked
:(( :(( :(( OK, now I'm just stalling work, I had a short night and I'm really not in the mood for yet another day of Crystal Reports...
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
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A friend of mine is thinking about a career change and she was thinking about programming. She's freaking smart, got multiple degrees, among which psychology. She's currently a primary school teacher, she loves the kids, but she dislikes lots of other things. So I'd like to show her some programming stuff, mostly that it's not that hard to learn (but impossible to master) and it's easy to get into. I'd like to start with some WinForms because it's very easy to grasp (it's how I got started) and then move on to some web programming. Just some C# and then JavaScript and HTML and CSS, probably a bit of SQL as well. The goal is to give her an idea about programming, what it is and how it works. I could even show her some production code. I'm not going to show her stuff like C or Python, simply because I don't know it myself. So, within the constraints of .NET and a fun afternoon, is there anything I absolutely should or should not show her? Looking for a sort of curriculum or idea, like a to-do list.
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
Find a personal project that matters to her. I have built an address book application in early every language I've learned. I know the requirements, e.g., I know what the final result should do, so I can focus on the construction and how the pieces-n-parts work together. Help her choose something that covers all the bases -- data storage (DB, XML, etc), middleware, and UI. This will help her round out her new skills while doing something completely practical. It also teaches data structure & management, which go beyond just coding.
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A friend of mine is thinking about a career change and she was thinking about programming. She's freaking smart, got multiple degrees, among which psychology. She's currently a primary school teacher, she loves the kids, but she dislikes lots of other things. So I'd like to show her some programming stuff, mostly that it's not that hard to learn (but impossible to master) and it's easy to get into. I'd like to start with some WinForms because it's very easy to grasp (it's how I got started) and then move on to some web programming. Just some C# and then JavaScript and HTML and CSS, probably a bit of SQL as well. The goal is to give her an idea about programming, what it is and how it works. I could even show her some production code. I'm not going to show her stuff like C or Python, simply because I don't know it myself. So, within the constraints of .NET and a fun afternoon, is there anything I absolutely should or should not show her? Looking for a sort of curriculum or idea, like a to-do list.
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
I'd change the order a bit: HTML->CSS->JavaScript->PHP->MySQL And that can be done rather pleasantly, with those "try it" editable example at W3Schools[^] For all but MySQL, she can download and use the still very nice FREE editor, Expressions 4 from MicroSloth. Vertrigo gives her a free WAMP server so she can start to play with her own fully functional webserver with very very little hassle (webserver, php, MySQL). The nice thing is she doesn't need to download anything for the first several steps. Just play. Keep her away from things like WordPress - or she'll possibly get sucked into the ignorance is bliss trap. As for something like (C/C++/C#) - that's for down the line and how her tastes fit into the world.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
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A friend of mine is thinking about a career change and she was thinking about programming. She's freaking smart, got multiple degrees, among which psychology. She's currently a primary school teacher, she loves the kids, but she dislikes lots of other things. So I'd like to show her some programming stuff, mostly that it's not that hard to learn (but impossible to master) and it's easy to get into. I'd like to start with some WinForms because it's very easy to grasp (it's how I got started) and then move on to some web programming. Just some C# and then JavaScript and HTML and CSS, probably a bit of SQL as well. The goal is to give her an idea about programming, what it is and how it works. I could even show her some production code. I'm not going to show her stuff like C or Python, simply because I don't know it myself. So, within the constraints of .NET and a fun afternoon, is there anything I absolutely should or should not show her? Looking for a sort of curriculum or idea, like a to-do list.
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
Leave Entity Framework and NHibernate off for a while. Of the three main paradigms of coding, introduce her to structural and object oriented and leave model programming for later.
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Comment, ( mostly to her ) I've "learned" a system while building a ( small ) working program ( IEC structured text - did it's job ). BUT, I'd a lot of background, and I still don't _know_ the language, and parts took extra work. Different people have different learning patterns, but I'd suggest a hybrid. Do a brief tutorial or book ( K&R comes to mind, but I'm a mechanic ) for basics, start, maybe do a project. Do a longer tutorial or course. ( repeat ?) The more formal will fill in lots of holes. ( This from someone who's written a couple of drivers then found he couldn't talk to a serial port in C# )
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A friend of mine is thinking about a career change and she was thinking about programming. She's freaking smart, got multiple degrees, among which psychology. She's currently a primary school teacher, she loves the kids, but she dislikes lots of other things. So I'd like to show her some programming stuff, mostly that it's not that hard to learn (but impossible to master) and it's easy to get into. I'd like to start with some WinForms because it's very easy to grasp (it's how I got started) and then move on to some web programming. Just some C# and then JavaScript and HTML and CSS, probably a bit of SQL as well. The goal is to give her an idea about programming, what it is and how it works. I could even show her some production code. I'm not going to show her stuff like C or Python, simply because I don't know it myself. So, within the constraints of .NET and a fun afternoon, is there anything I absolutely should or should not show her? Looking for a sort of curriculum or idea, like a to-do list.
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
When I read the subject of your post and the first paragraph, my knee-jerk was "learn Python first" then "learn C++", but it appears your advice is focused on web development. Web development will show the fruits of your labor pretty quickly and that may motivate you to "keep going", no doubt about it, but I feel that Python also does this to only a slightly lesser extent. It is interpreted (no need to compile), has a lot of features to play around with (GUI, client/server, parsing, files, text processing, AI/ML, and on and on...) to make neat apps and games while also teaching concepts like object-oriented design (OOD), program structure / modularity, and multi-file projects and organization. C++ will layer on top of the OOD and multi-file project concepts while teaching new concepts like pointers and understanding the compile/link build process via gcc/g++/Makefile's, etc. Another path I would consider is maybe Android development (through Android Studio) - I'd lean towards Kotlin, but Java has more general use, so I'm not writing that off. Again, you can see the fruits of your labor quickly while making cool little apps on your Android phone or tablet.
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A friend of mine is thinking about a career change and she was thinking about programming. She's freaking smart, got multiple degrees, among which psychology. She's currently a primary school teacher, she loves the kids, but she dislikes lots of other things. So I'd like to show her some programming stuff, mostly that it's not that hard to learn (but impossible to master) and it's easy to get into. I'd like to start with some WinForms because it's very easy to grasp (it's how I got started) and then move on to some web programming. Just some C# and then JavaScript and HTML and CSS, probably a bit of SQL as well. The goal is to give her an idea about programming, what it is and how it works. I could even show her some production code. I'm not going to show her stuff like C or Python, simply because I don't know it myself. So, within the constraints of .NET and a fun afternoon, is there anything I absolutely should or should not show her? Looking for a sort of curriculum or idea, like a to-do list.
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
There is an app called Grasshopper, which is designed to teach programming to beginners. I learned SQL initially because a work program used that to do custom reporting. The program's help guide was amazingly good at teaching SQL. Other languages I've learned by just getting one of those "how to code in X" books and going through it. The trick is to fix every program they create because none of them work as written. Forces one to learn more, faster. I agree that getting her interested in a problem that needs solving, then doing the code to solve it, is way better than hello world. Hello World requires too much knowledge of computers and programs before one can even start to really understand what it does. Bond Keep all things a simple as possible, but no simpler. -said someone, somewhere
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A friend of mine is thinking about a career change and she was thinking about programming. She's freaking smart, got multiple degrees, among which psychology. She's currently a primary school teacher, she loves the kids, but she dislikes lots of other things. So I'd like to show her some programming stuff, mostly that it's not that hard to learn (but impossible to master) and it's easy to get into. I'd like to start with some WinForms because it's very easy to grasp (it's how I got started) and then move on to some web programming. Just some C# and then JavaScript and HTML and CSS, probably a bit of SQL as well. The goal is to give her an idea about programming, what it is and how it works. I could even show her some production code. I'm not going to show her stuff like C or Python, simply because I don't know it myself. So, within the constraints of .NET and a fun afternoon, is there anything I absolutely should or should not show her? Looking for a sort of curriculum or idea, like a to-do list.
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
Are you wanting to teach her how to write code, or how to solve problems using code? In my opinion, they are vastly different.
"One man's wage rise is another man's price increase." - Harold Wilson
"Fireproof doesn't mean the fire will never come. It means when the fire comes that you will be able to withstand it." - Michael Simmons
"You can easily judge the character of a man by how he treats those who can do nothing for him." - James D. Miles
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A friend of mine is thinking about a career change and she was thinking about programming. She's freaking smart, got multiple degrees, among which psychology. She's currently a primary school teacher, she loves the kids, but she dislikes lots of other things. So I'd like to show her some programming stuff, mostly that it's not that hard to learn (but impossible to master) and it's easy to get into. I'd like to start with some WinForms because it's very easy to grasp (it's how I got started) and then move on to some web programming. Just some C# and then JavaScript and HTML and CSS, probably a bit of SQL as well. The goal is to give her an idea about programming, what it is and how it works. I could even show her some production code. I'm not going to show her stuff like C or Python, simply because I don't know it myself. So, within the constraints of .NET and a fun afternoon, is there anything I absolutely should or should not show her? Looking for a sort of curriculum or idea, like a to-do list.
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
I saved this link a time ago from a similar conversation... I think it might help you. It works best in Chrome: Learn to Program[^] It might help you a lot to give a fast introduction in this world
M.D.V. ;) If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about? Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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A friend of mine is thinking about a career change and she was thinking about programming. She's freaking smart, got multiple degrees, among which psychology. She's currently a primary school teacher, she loves the kids, but she dislikes lots of other things. So I'd like to show her some programming stuff, mostly that it's not that hard to learn (but impossible to master) and it's easy to get into. I'd like to start with some WinForms because it's very easy to grasp (it's how I got started) and then move on to some web programming. Just some C# and then JavaScript and HTML and CSS, probably a bit of SQL as well. The goal is to give her an idea about programming, what it is and how it works. I could even show her some production code. I'm not going to show her stuff like C or Python, simply because I don't know it myself. So, within the constraints of .NET and a fun afternoon, is there anything I absolutely should or should not show her? Looking for a sort of curriculum or idea, like a to-do list.
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
As a novice who started with a DEC writer in collage I was hooked but no one could buy a DEC writer Then I got a 40 column Apple But what sparks anyone's desire to code is to write your own application one you want Coding is WORK the fun is saying I WANT A Diary Checkbook Tracker When your desire to have your own program the work to code it becomes the fun Which for many of you here has developed into a enjoyable way to earn a living
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A friend of mine is thinking about a career change and she was thinking about programming. She's freaking smart, got multiple degrees, among which psychology. She's currently a primary school teacher, she loves the kids, but she dislikes lots of other things. So I'd like to show her some programming stuff, mostly that it's not that hard to learn (but impossible to master) and it's easy to get into. I'd like to start with some WinForms because it's very easy to grasp (it's how I got started) and then move on to some web programming. Just some C# and then JavaScript and HTML and CSS, probably a bit of SQL as well. The goal is to give her an idea about programming, what it is and how it works. I could even show her some production code. I'm not going to show her stuff like C or Python, simply because I don't know it myself. So, within the constraints of .NET and a fun afternoon, is there anything I absolutely should or should not show her? Looking for a sort of curriculum or idea, like a to-do list.
Best, Sander sanderrossel.com Migrating Applications to the Cloud with Azure arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
I've found that most problems that are interesting to non-programmers are way out of reach of a beginning programmer. Instead, maybe find out what she wants to do with her new skills, then teach her pieces along that path. I'd actually suggest taking one of the video courses for learning the programming stuff with her. You could come up with the course material and organize it into a meaningful sequence yourself, but that's a lot of work for one student, and you're limited to the languages and tools that you know. I've found that writing games has been one of the most motivating things to engage new programming students with. It is amazing how little code is needed to make an interesting game that sparks a student's interest. The simplest was the one-if-statement wumpus "game" we used in our Java class as our first-program intro to teach the students how to use the Java compiler.
I live in Oregon, and I'm an engineer.
