Chronic low self-esteem?
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Jamie Hale wrote: Anyone else here suffer from this? What do you do to cope? Some people use Viagra :-D I had exactly the opposite problem. I was overly confident on myself. And then, I humbly looked for professional help. It worked: now, I'm perfect, almost a god. ORACLE One Real A$#h%le Called Lary Ellison
Daniel, meet John. John, this is Daniel. You two have a lot in common. :rolleyes:
Software Zen:
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Identify your insecurities and then get rid of them. Me, I used to fat, and I was insecure about it. Well, I lost the fat! Seems simple, but few rarely do it. It's liberating actually. Jeremy Falcon
I believe this is part of my problem. I'm not sure what my insecurities are. I've been trying to figure it out, but when I look back at my life, I can identify times very early on where I've lashed out or tried to overcompensate for a lack of confidence. To me, this means I've been dealing with this stuff for a bunch of years. One completely vain possibility is that I feel I've been alienated most my life because I'm a red-head. I'm sure it's a self-imposed feeling of alienation, but real nonetheless. And simply dying my hair isn't going to accomplish anything. :) J
"You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant."
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Anyone else here suffer from this? What do you do to cope? J
"You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant."
Over my lifetime I have observed that people with low self esteem are usually right.;)
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And the wisdom to tell them apart :rose: Elaine (philosophical fluffy tigress) The tigress is here :-D
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Jamie Hale wrote: What do you do to cope? Once when a wiser older co-worker and myself stumbled upon a screwed up jumble of poorly engineered equipment that we had to fix, I started ranting and raving about it and generally getting all pissed off, he said: "At 80 feet long and weighing over 100 tons the Blue whale is the largest mammal to ever inhabit the earth, yet it's throat opening is no bigger around than yours or mine. There's nothing the whale can do about it. So stop screaming about what 'should be' and hand me a damn wrench." 'nuff said.
Work like you don't need the money.
Love like you've never been hurt.
Dance like nobody's watching.Excellent, and a 5 :cool: The tigress is here :-D
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Anyone else here suffer from this? What do you do to cope? J
"You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant."
"My gym is the International House of Pancakes. There's no reason to body build. That's why God gave us the Internation House of Pancakes. No matter how bad you feel about yourself their'll always be someone who's 500lbs heavier then you'll ever be their. It's on the back of the menu, read it sometime!"
..........Zack.......... Developer Extraordinaire && Full Time Geek
"Don't go out of your way to step on people's toes, but don't stop walking all-together." GCS\P\SS d- s-:- a-- C++$ U--- P--- L- E- W++ N o K-? w+++ O++ !M-- V PS+ PE Y+ PGP t+ 5+ X+ R++ tv++ b++ DI++ D+++ G+>G++++ e* h- r++ y+
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By putting it in perspective. cheers, Chris Maunder
Putting what in perspective? The things I can and cannot change? J
"You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant."
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Same here. I am stopped dead in my tracks wondering what the point of the statement might be. Given how the whale feeds, he has little need for a larger opening. Then again, I was never much on dime store philosophy. Tim Smith I'm going to patent thought. I have yet to see any prior art.
It's the "don't worry about what you can't change" philosphy. It's similar to the Buddhist philosphy: "Do not concern yourselvs with the things you cannot change. If you cannot change them, do not worry about them. For what is the use of worrying? All your worrying will change nothing. If you can change something, change it. Do not worry about it, simply change it." Basically: Don't worry about what you can't change and don't complain about what you can change, change it, don't complain.
..........Zack.......... Developer Extraordinaire && Full Time Geek
"Don't go out of your way to step on people's toes, but don't stop walking all-together." GCS\P\SS d- s-:- a-- C++$ U--- P--- L- E- W++ N o K-? w+++ O++ !M-- V PS+ PE Y+ PGP t+ 5+ X+ R++ tv++ b++ DI++ D+++ G+>G++++ e* h- r++ y+
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Jamie Hale wrote: What do you do to cope? Once when a wiser older co-worker and myself stumbled upon a screwed up jumble of poorly engineered equipment that we had to fix, I started ranting and raving about it and generally getting all pissed off, he said: "At 80 feet long and weighing over 100 tons the Blue whale is the largest mammal to ever inhabit the earth, yet it's throat opening is no bigger around than yours or mine. There's nothing the whale can do about it. So stop screaming about what 'should be' and hand me a damn wrench." 'nuff said.
Work like you don't need the money.
Love like you've never been hurt.
Dance like nobody's watching.A good anecdote - I just don't see how it applies. :) From time to time I have low self-esteem. Are you suggesting that I shouldn't complain about it? Just keep it all to myself? J
"You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant."
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Jamie Hale wrote: Anyone else here suffer from this? No. Jamie Hale wrote: What do you do to cope? Go to the mall and watch the people. Instant low self-esteem cure. :-D Marc Help! I'm an AI running around in someone's f*cked up universe simulator.
Sensitivity and ethnic diversity means celebrating difference, not hiding from it. - Christian Graus
Every line of code is a liability - Taka Muraoka
Microsoft deliberately adds arbitrary layers of complexity to make it difficult to deliver Windows features on non-Windows platforms--Microsoft's "Halloween files"Marc Clifton wrote: Go to the mall and watch the people. Instant low self-esteem cure. :) Thanks for the smile. However... that's part of the problem. One of the things I do to compensate for my low self-esteem is to be critical of others. I've come far enough to realize that this is how I deal with it, and I don't like it. I don't like to be that holier-than-thou person. J
"You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant."
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I used to for years. Until I learned from women that I am one hell of a catch even though I am not the best looking guy in the world. This will give you confidence and women will notice it. And then what you thought as impossible (finding an attractive woman) becomes easy.... John
:) I appreciate the input. However, I've been happily married for 5 years now, and have a beautiful daughter. :) Women aren't the problem. Or at least not the major problem. The issue is that I find myself thinking (almost knowing) that I'm better than everyone else. Mostly at my job, but at other things in life too. I don't like this feeling, and attribute it to a lack of self-confidence. I believe I'm a fine catch too. A good husband and a good father. J
"You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant."
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A good anecdote - I just don't see how it applies. :) From time to time I have low self-esteem. Are you suggesting that I shouldn't complain about it? Just keep it all to myself? J
"You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant."
Jamie Hale wrote: Are you suggesting that I shouldn't complain about it? Low-self esteem is too broad a brush. Try to look for the details. If you're sad that you're too short or too tall. Move on - it can't be changed so there is no point worrying about it. If you're sad that you're too fat or too thin than start doing something about it. It can be changed so make it better. If it's less physical and more "virtual" like: I don't like my housing situation, employment, social life, etc... than it's time to start taking some chances or big moves on the way to self improvement. If it's a general sense of "blah" without any specifics attached that's lasted for more than a few weeks, than I'd see a doctor about low level depression. A few months of Prozac or Paxil might just do the trick. Jamie Hale wrote: Just keep it all to myself? Nope - talking about problems and issues is almost always beneficial, just try not to stress or become depressed about things that cannot change. What's the point?
Work like you don't need the money.
Love like you've never been hurt.
Dance like nobody's watching. -
I'm pretty sure this is normal for most geekish types :) After 12 years at school knowing very few people with the same interests, it's bound to happen. I'm pretty sure that's why we're all drawn to CP so much - it's a relief to find people we can relate to. I know my body language isn't always "normal", probably due to a poor attempt at hiding shyness. I usually cope with this by making jokes (often out of place). But at the same time, I'm not too bothered if people don't understand me - I like being on my own, it gives me time to think, contemplate and enjoy my own company :) One thing I can suggest, is smile (but not too enthusiastically). Being different from the norm doesn't make someone a nasty person, it just makes them unusual. While I don't mind people misunderstanding me, it would bother me if someone thought I was cruel or uncaring. Don't feel alone :rose: What do you do to cope btw?
To honor you, and your sick games, this smiley ;p will now represent licking chocolate off candy - David Chamberlain
Megan Forbes wrote: I'm pretty sure this is normal for most geekish types I would bet money on it. :) That's why I asked here. Megan Forbes wrote: it would bother me if someone thought I was cruel or uncaring. Why is this? I have the same problem. In answering this post, I think I've stumbled on another piece of the puzzle. I have been cruel to people throughout my life - hurtful - from time to time, but now I look back and know that I've changed. I have grown substantially in the past few years. When people misinterpret what I say, I worry that they don't see that I'm not that person anymore. Hmmmm. :) Megan Forbes wrote: What do you do to cope btw? This. :) Ponder. I write in my diary. I skip work a lot. I watch Office Space and Fight Club. I put aside all my geek projects (because I lay part of the blame on my inability to do things in moderation). I read. Most of all, I make large changes in my life. Last time I had this big a bout of it, I cancelled cable and went back to dial-up. I had a little bonfire as a symbolic purging of all the things I don't want to be anymore. I wrote many pages each day in my diary - analyzing this and that aspect of my life, trying to find a clue as to what causes this type of mindset. And on and on... It tends to take over. I don't think it's destructive at all. My wife and my mother-in-law get concerned, but I'm not the type to consider suicide or anything that drastic. My home life is wonderful - in fact I'd bet it's my wife and daughter that keep me sane. :) I guess, more than anything, I spend a lot of time thinking about what it is I want out of life. J
"You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant."
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Over my lifetime I have observed that people with low self esteem are usually right.;)
:) From where I sit, that can be taken in one of several ways: 1) People with low self esteem deserve to have low self esteem. or 2) People with low self esteem are usually correct. I'm guessing you mean the first? J
"You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant."
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:) I appreciate the input. However, I've been happily married for 5 years now, and have a beautiful daughter. :) Women aren't the problem. Or at least not the major problem. The issue is that I find myself thinking (almost knowing) that I'm better than everyone else. Mostly at my job, but at other things in life too. I don't like this feeling, and attribute it to a lack of self-confidence. I believe I'm a fine catch too. A good husband and a good father. J
"You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant."
Jamie Hale wrote: However, I've been happily married for 5 years now, and have a beautiful daughter. Women aren't the problem. Or at least not the major problem. Sorry if I jumped in late I did not read the gazillion replies... Jamie Hale wrote: The issue is that I find myself thinking (almost knowing) that I'm better than everyone else. Mostly at my job, but at other things in life too. I don't like this feeling, and attribute it to a lack of self-confidence. :confused: I have the same feelings and I attribrute it to a lot of self-confidence. John
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Marc Clifton wrote: Go to the mall and watch the people. Instant low self-esteem cure. :) Thanks for the smile. However... that's part of the problem. One of the things I do to compensate for my low self-esteem is to be critical of others. I've come far enough to realize that this is how I deal with it, and I don't like it. I don't like to be that holier-than-thou person. J
"You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant."
Jamie Hale wrote: One of the things I do to compensate for my low self-esteem is to be critical of others. Well, it's one thing to be critical, which in itself leads to low self-esteem, and another thing to acknowledge the differences in people. If you don't do that, it's pretty much impossible to work with people, because you have to figure out how each person is different. Their strengths AND their weaknesses. Jamie Hale wrote: I don't like to be that holier-than-thou person. The other instant cure for low self-esteem is the Dale Carnegie approach. Instead of the 3 C's--criticize, complain, and condemn--find something sincerely positive to say or think about a person. You feel better, because all of a sudden your world IS better. A person smiling back from a compliment is a powerful thing. Marc Help! I'm an AI running around in someone's f*cked up universe simulator.
Sensitivity and ethnic diversity means celebrating difference, not hiding from it. - Christian Graus
Every line of code is a liability - Taka Muraoka
Microsoft deliberately adds arbitrary layers of complexity to make it difficult to deliver Windows features on non-Windows platforms--Microsoft's "Halloween files" -
Identify your insecurities and then get rid of them. Me, I used to fat, and I was insecure about it. Well, I lost the fat! Seems simple, but few rarely do it. It's liberating actually. Jeremy Falcon
Jeremy Falcon wrote: Me, I used to fat, You fat??? Dang, from your bio pic, you look pretty studly to me. (And don't go getting any ideas about my preferences. I think a man can say that to another man without all sorts of idiotic ideas coming into one's head). Marc Help! I'm an AI running around in someone's f*cked up universe simulator.
Sensitivity and ethnic diversity means celebrating difference, not hiding from it. - Christian Graus
Every line of code is a liability - Taka Muraoka
Microsoft deliberately adds arbitrary layers of complexity to make it difficult to deliver Windows features on non-Windows platforms--Microsoft's "Halloween files" -
Jamie Hale wrote: Are you suggesting that I shouldn't complain about it? Low-self esteem is too broad a brush. Try to look for the details. If you're sad that you're too short or too tall. Move on - it can't be changed so there is no point worrying about it. If you're sad that you're too fat or too thin than start doing something about it. It can be changed so make it better. If it's less physical and more "virtual" like: I don't like my housing situation, employment, social life, etc... than it's time to start taking some chances or big moves on the way to self improvement. If it's a general sense of "blah" without any specifics attached that's lasted for more than a few weeks, than I'd see a doctor about low level depression. A few months of Prozac or Paxil might just do the trick. Jamie Hale wrote: Just keep it all to myself? Nope - talking about problems and issues is almost always beneficial, just try not to stress or become depressed about things that cannot change. What's the point?
Work like you don't need the money.
Love like you've never been hurt.
Dance like nobody's watching.Mike Mullikin wrote: just try not to stress or become depressed about things that cannot change. What's the point? I wholehearted agree. Buddhism was mentioned elsewhere in this thread, and if I could reduce my situation to an issue that I can change or cannot change, I would be so happy. Perhaps that's where I should be aiming... Regardless, it's not a physical thing at all. Sure I'm short and a little overweight, but I exercise and most of the time I feel good about myself physically. It's also not a sense of "blah" - unless it's coupled with fatigue. Then I just need to sleep it off. Most of the time I'm driven to do something: write, think, exercise, etc. Usually, it manifests itself as an unhappiness in my job. Now it could be a simple as me not being in the right career, but then I end up down the path of "well what the hell should I be doing - I don't know how to do anything other than programming" or "I have a gigantic debt load - we'd be screwed if I quit my job - no other career will pay me this much". Then I start to wonder why I can't just put up with my job like everyone else. And I wonder why I can't just find what it is a really want to do with my life, and be strong enough to do it regardless of the consequences (financially and socially). Then I watch Office Space again. Then I harken back to all the cool stuff I've read about Luddism and Anarchy. And then I get all pissed off because Office Space had this cool Luddism/Anarchism theme running through it up until the middle someplace where they had to introduce the ultimate plot device - the computer virus. But I digress. I think you've helped to compartmentalize the problem for me. It's probably going to resolve itself with me either putting up with it, or me making a significant change. And by "putting up with it", I mean accepting that I'm one of those people who doesn't like (career) work. :) No clue what the significant change might be. Thanks for the input. J
"You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant."
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Jamie Hale wrote: What do you do to cope? strong drinks long naps staring glassy-eyed into the distance hoping for the end To vote with no response is to follow the way of the coward.
Chris Losinger wrote: strong drinks Yah, and that's part of the problem I'm sure. I've just determined recently that alcohol is a trigger for some rather unpleasant reactions in my gut. I have a cellar full of wine, and a bar filled with a nice collection of single-malts. :mad: J
"You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant."
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Money. I buy things. (responsibly). Works a treat as it gives you something bright to look forward to at the end fo the day. Friends try and help, and do to an extent, but other than theat I haven't found anything that works. What is bad for me is that I never had any of this six years ago so like a seeing person who was blinded I know what I am missing out on, and that is like digging in a hole. CodeProject has a great bunch of people and is a great place to work on things, only helped by the number of people willing to go completely out of their way to asist you. (yes I will reply to you btw, you know who you are). I know far too well that when you are really feeling the blunt end of low self-esteem the last person you want to be left along with is yourself. At the recomendation of a friend who suffers from chronic depression (oh the circles I choose to be in!) I have created a journal which I write in whenever I am feeling down. Having to organise your thoughts onto paper or screen helps you sort them out in nyour head as well. I've found it very effective recently to quickly deal with self esteem problems and general depression and get on with things; you may like to give it a try. If you have MSN Messenger, add me to your contacts (e-mail is the same as the one this message was sent from). I love to listen and having someone to bounce thoughts off of when you are low can really help. That is a two way contract though... :)
David Wulff
"It is a helpless feeling to be unable to make something so terribly wrong... right."
David Wulff wrote: What is bad for me is that I never had any of this six years ago so like a seeing person who was blinded I know what I am missing out on, and that is like digging in a hole. It just never dawned on me until I had my little, "goddam I've been an asshole to a lot of people" epiphany. I don't like to dwell on it, but there's still a fair amount of regret that I didn't realize how much I was hurting people earlier. David Wulff wrote: the last person you want to be left along with is yourself. Interesting. When I'm down, I really enjoy being by myself. That way, I can talk to myself and I don't get the weird looks from my family. :) :~ David Wulff wrote: I have created a journal which I write in whenever I am feeling down. Having to organise your thoughts onto paper or screen helps you sort them out in nyour head as well. I've found it very effective recently to quickly deal with self esteem problems and general depression and get on with things; you may like to give it a try. I have several of them. :) I found it really rewarding to know that I can express most of what I'm feeling, and I don't have to worry about getting the wording wrong when trying to explain it to someone else. Plus, it's a good place to keep track of how far I've progressed in my own little amateur psychoanalysis of myself. David Wulff wrote: If you have MSN Messenger, add me to your contacts (e-mail is the same as the one this message was sent from). I love to listen and having someone to bounce thoughts off of when you are low can really help. That is a two way contract though... I appreciate it David. Thanks. I've been IM clean-and-sober for 25 months now. :) That being said, I intend to formalize the progress I'm making in writing. Perhaps I'll fire it across the pond for a critical review? :) Thanks for the input. J
"You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant."