Eliminating old books
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After eliminating valueless textbooks after graduating college, I made it a point to NOT buy technical books. Other folks may go to an extreme -- one guy I worked with had a bookcase 8' tall and 12' wide, literally overflowing with technical books. Each time he touched a new technology, he purchased at least 3 new books. When he moved offices, it took him 2 days to move all the books. Having spent 25+ years as a consultant/contractor, when I needed technical books, I talked the client into buying them. The same conversation was conducted repeatedly with each client: "You know you can't keep the books when your contract ends?" Yeah, that was actually the idea. I had no idea what the future would bring in terms of technology I would work with, so I'd talk the next client into buying what I need for that contract. Saved me money AND I didn't have to move the books. When I went into a client site for the first time, I carried my briefcase and one bag of "stuff", and when I left, I did the same. That said, this morning I looked at the bookcase in my home office and wondered what I'd do with the few books I purchased that are LONG outdated. Keeping with my "don't buy" mantra, there's only 5: Microsoft C Programming for the PC XML for Dummies Learn ASP.NET in 21 Days (probably v1) Professional C# 2008 Professional WordPress (probably v2) Is there any value in books this old? WordPress is probably 12 yo and it's the youngest. ASP and XML are circa 2000, and C is circa 1990. I hate to toss them in the landfill but can't figure out a use for them.
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After eliminating valueless textbooks after graduating college, I made it a point to NOT buy technical books. Other folks may go to an extreme -- one guy I worked with had a bookcase 8' tall and 12' wide, literally overflowing with technical books. Each time he touched a new technology, he purchased at least 3 new books. When he moved offices, it took him 2 days to move all the books. Having spent 25+ years as a consultant/contractor, when I needed technical books, I talked the client into buying them. The same conversation was conducted repeatedly with each client: "You know you can't keep the books when your contract ends?" Yeah, that was actually the idea. I had no idea what the future would bring in terms of technology I would work with, so I'd talk the next client into buying what I need for that contract. Saved me money AND I didn't have to move the books. When I went into a client site for the first time, I carried my briefcase and one bag of "stuff", and when I left, I did the same. That said, this morning I looked at the bookcase in my home office and wondered what I'd do with the few books I purchased that are LONG outdated. Keeping with my "don't buy" mantra, there's only 5: Microsoft C Programming for the PC XML for Dummies Learn ASP.NET in 21 Days (probably v1) Professional C# 2008 Professional WordPress (probably v2) Is there any value in books this old? WordPress is probably 12 yo and it's the youngest. ASP and XML are circa 2000, and C is circa 1990. I hate to toss them in the landfill but can't figure out a use for them.
Bequeath them in your will, let your ancestors deal with what to do with them.
I’ve given up trying to be calm. However, I am open to feeling slightly less agitated. I’m begging you for the benefit of everyone, don’t be STUPID.
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After eliminating valueless textbooks after graduating college, I made it a point to NOT buy technical books. Other folks may go to an extreme -- one guy I worked with had a bookcase 8' tall and 12' wide, literally overflowing with technical books. Each time he touched a new technology, he purchased at least 3 new books. When he moved offices, it took him 2 days to move all the books. Having spent 25+ years as a consultant/contractor, when I needed technical books, I talked the client into buying them. The same conversation was conducted repeatedly with each client: "You know you can't keep the books when your contract ends?" Yeah, that was actually the idea. I had no idea what the future would bring in terms of technology I would work with, so I'd talk the next client into buying what I need for that contract. Saved me money AND I didn't have to move the books. When I went into a client site for the first time, I carried my briefcase and one bag of "stuff", and when I left, I did the same. That said, this morning I looked at the bookcase in my home office and wondered what I'd do with the few books I purchased that are LONG outdated. Keeping with my "don't buy" mantra, there's only 5: Microsoft C Programming for the PC XML for Dummies Learn ASP.NET in 21 Days (probably v1) Professional C# 2008 Professional WordPress (probably v2) Is there any value in books this old? WordPress is probably 12 yo and it's the youngest. ASP and XML are circa 2000, and C is circa 1990. I hate to toss them in the landfill but can't figure out a use for them.
Sell or trade them New & Used Books | Buy Cheap Books Online at ThriftBooks[^]
A home without books is a body without soul. Marcus Tullius Cicero PartsBin an Electronics Part Organizer - Release Version 1.4.0 (Many new features) JaxCoder.com Latest Article: EventAggregator
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After eliminating valueless textbooks after graduating college, I made it a point to NOT buy technical books. Other folks may go to an extreme -- one guy I worked with had a bookcase 8' tall and 12' wide, literally overflowing with technical books. Each time he touched a new technology, he purchased at least 3 new books. When he moved offices, it took him 2 days to move all the books. Having spent 25+ years as a consultant/contractor, when I needed technical books, I talked the client into buying them. The same conversation was conducted repeatedly with each client: "You know you can't keep the books when your contract ends?" Yeah, that was actually the idea. I had no idea what the future would bring in terms of technology I would work with, so I'd talk the next client into buying what I need for that contract. Saved me money AND I didn't have to move the books. When I went into a client site for the first time, I carried my briefcase and one bag of "stuff", and when I left, I did the same. That said, this morning I looked at the bookcase in my home office and wondered what I'd do with the few books I purchased that are LONG outdated. Keeping with my "don't buy" mantra, there's only 5: Microsoft C Programming for the PC XML for Dummies Learn ASP.NET in 21 Days (probably v1) Professional C# 2008 Professional WordPress (probably v2) Is there any value in books this old? WordPress is probably 12 yo and it's the youngest. ASP and XML are circa 2000, and C is circa 1990. I hate to toss them in the landfill but can't figure out a use for them.
I have zero nostalgia with paper books, especially technical books. (with some exceptions) I moved houses too many times with too many cases of books. I've recycled most of them and gave a few. I still have a small bookshelf with 2 dozen dusty books.
CI/CD = Continuous Impediment/Continuous Despair
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After eliminating valueless textbooks after graduating college, I made it a point to NOT buy technical books. Other folks may go to an extreme -- one guy I worked with had a bookcase 8' tall and 12' wide, literally overflowing with technical books. Each time he touched a new technology, he purchased at least 3 new books. When he moved offices, it took him 2 days to move all the books. Having spent 25+ years as a consultant/contractor, when I needed technical books, I talked the client into buying them. The same conversation was conducted repeatedly with each client: "You know you can't keep the books when your contract ends?" Yeah, that was actually the idea. I had no idea what the future would bring in terms of technology I would work with, so I'd talk the next client into buying what I need for that contract. Saved me money AND I didn't have to move the books. When I went into a client site for the first time, I carried my briefcase and one bag of "stuff", and when I left, I did the same. That said, this morning I looked at the bookcase in my home office and wondered what I'd do with the few books I purchased that are LONG outdated. Keeping with my "don't buy" mantra, there's only 5: Microsoft C Programming for the PC XML for Dummies Learn ASP.NET in 21 Days (probably v1) Professional C# 2008 Professional WordPress (probably v2) Is there any value in books this old? WordPress is probably 12 yo and it's the youngest. ASP and XML are circa 2000, and C is circa 1990. I hate to toss them in the landfill but can't figure out a use for them.
Looking around at the shelf behind me I see a dozen or two such books. I may still have some boxed up after my latest move (five years ago). Some date back to the 80s. I don't think I've bought a new technical book since around 2010, but I have bought/acquired used ones. For instance, I have a COBOL book someone was giving away a few years back.
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After eliminating valueless textbooks after graduating college, I made it a point to NOT buy technical books. Other folks may go to an extreme -- one guy I worked with had a bookcase 8' tall and 12' wide, literally overflowing with technical books. Each time he touched a new technology, he purchased at least 3 new books. When he moved offices, it took him 2 days to move all the books. Having spent 25+ years as a consultant/contractor, when I needed technical books, I talked the client into buying them. The same conversation was conducted repeatedly with each client: "You know you can't keep the books when your contract ends?" Yeah, that was actually the idea. I had no idea what the future would bring in terms of technology I would work with, so I'd talk the next client into buying what I need for that contract. Saved me money AND I didn't have to move the books. When I went into a client site for the first time, I carried my briefcase and one bag of "stuff", and when I left, I did the same. That said, this morning I looked at the bookcase in my home office and wondered what I'd do with the few books I purchased that are LONG outdated. Keeping with my "don't buy" mantra, there's only 5: Microsoft C Programming for the PC XML for Dummies Learn ASP.NET in 21 Days (probably v1) Professional C# 2008 Professional WordPress (probably v2) Is there any value in books this old? WordPress is probably 12 yo and it's the youngest. ASP and XML are circa 2000, and C is circa 1990. I hate to toss them in the landfill but can't figure out a use for them.
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Bequeath them in your will, let your ancestors deal with what to do with them.
I’ve given up trying to be calm. However, I am open to feeling slightly less agitated. I’m begging you for the benefit of everyone, don’t be STUPID.
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After eliminating valueless textbooks after graduating college, I made it a point to NOT buy technical books. Other folks may go to an extreme -- one guy I worked with had a bookcase 8' tall and 12' wide, literally overflowing with technical books. Each time he touched a new technology, he purchased at least 3 new books. When he moved offices, it took him 2 days to move all the books. Having spent 25+ years as a consultant/contractor, when I needed technical books, I talked the client into buying them. The same conversation was conducted repeatedly with each client: "You know you can't keep the books when your contract ends?" Yeah, that was actually the idea. I had no idea what the future would bring in terms of technology I would work with, so I'd talk the next client into buying what I need for that contract. Saved me money AND I didn't have to move the books. When I went into a client site for the first time, I carried my briefcase and one bag of "stuff", and when I left, I did the same. That said, this morning I looked at the bookcase in my home office and wondered what I'd do with the few books I purchased that are LONG outdated. Keeping with my "don't buy" mantra, there's only 5: Microsoft C Programming for the PC XML for Dummies Learn ASP.NET in 21 Days (probably v1) Professional C# 2008 Professional WordPress (probably v2) Is there any value in books this old? WordPress is probably 12 yo and it's the youngest. ASP and XML are circa 2000, and C is circa 1990. I hate to toss them in the landfill but can't figure out a use for them.
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After eliminating valueless textbooks after graduating college, I made it a point to NOT buy technical books. Other folks may go to an extreme -- one guy I worked with had a bookcase 8' tall and 12' wide, literally overflowing with technical books. Each time he touched a new technology, he purchased at least 3 new books. When he moved offices, it took him 2 days to move all the books. Having spent 25+ years as a consultant/contractor, when I needed technical books, I talked the client into buying them. The same conversation was conducted repeatedly with each client: "You know you can't keep the books when your contract ends?" Yeah, that was actually the idea. I had no idea what the future would bring in terms of technology I would work with, so I'd talk the next client into buying what I need for that contract. Saved me money AND I didn't have to move the books. When I went into a client site for the first time, I carried my briefcase and one bag of "stuff", and when I left, I did the same. That said, this morning I looked at the bookcase in my home office and wondered what I'd do with the few books I purchased that are LONG outdated. Keeping with my "don't buy" mantra, there's only 5: Microsoft C Programming for the PC XML for Dummies Learn ASP.NET in 21 Days (probably v1) Professional C# 2008 Professional WordPress (probably v2) Is there any value in books this old? WordPress is probably 12 yo and it's the youngest. ASP and XML are circa 2000, and C is circa 1990. I hate to toss them in the landfill but can't figure out a use for them.
BryanFazekas wrote:
I'd talk the next client into buying what I need for that contract.
I know a guy who does house renovations for a living. If there's an unusual tool he doesn't already have but needs for a job, he buys it and keeps it (or rents it for the duration needed if he knows he's never gonna use it ever again, or so rarely he can't justify the purchase). He doesn't make the customer buy it and then hand it over when the job's done. The customer has no need for the tool. Things might be different in the software world; if you need a license to use some software, and the customer needs to run that software, this makes sense...but books? Even though you hand it to the customer after the job's done, you don't wipe out from your mind what you've learned from the book. You're the main beneficiary. And the customer (in all likelihood) also has no need for the book. But, I've never done any contracting...maybe I'd change my mind if I was, or was working on stuff I have zero interest in after the job was done. Otherwise, I'd buy, and keep. In any case...I did get rid (last year or so) of a big pile of books, maybe 5 feet high if I had stacked them all. Clearly some stuff I'll never use again. Although the hoarder archivist in me kinda regrets throwing away at least some of them. Some were brand new (clearly I got by without reading them...) I just never had a "proper" bookshelf and the books were just taking up place in a number of boxes on the floor of a closet. Otherwise I probably would've hung onto a few of them (some I was happy to be rid of). What annoyed me the most is that I had checked with my local library to see if they'd take them, rather than sending them for recycling (which I know in some cases still end up in a landfill anyway). They wouldn't take anything older than 5 years. Yet these are the same people who are constantly complaining they're underfunded. They weren't junk, and I'm sure if I had bothered I might have found some buyers, even if only for historical value.
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Compared to my bookshelf, those are practically brand new. I still have books on (MS-)DOS internals and an old 8086/8088 programmers guide that details the entire instruction set.
Last year I threw away books from that era covering similar topics. One I remember buying and then reading, and it went way over my head (I was in my early teens and had a hard time already understanding books written in English, let alone the subject matter). I went back to it years later, and (re-)discovered interrupt programming. Then it turned out for years to be one of my favorite books. I also had about half a dozen OS/2 books - one with a foreword from Bill Gates.
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After eliminating valueless textbooks after graduating college, I made it a point to NOT buy technical books. Other folks may go to an extreme -- one guy I worked with had a bookcase 8' tall and 12' wide, literally overflowing with technical books. Each time he touched a new technology, he purchased at least 3 new books. When he moved offices, it took him 2 days to move all the books. Having spent 25+ years as a consultant/contractor, when I needed technical books, I talked the client into buying them. The same conversation was conducted repeatedly with each client: "You know you can't keep the books when your contract ends?" Yeah, that was actually the idea. I had no idea what the future would bring in terms of technology I would work with, so I'd talk the next client into buying what I need for that contract. Saved me money AND I didn't have to move the books. When I went into a client site for the first time, I carried my briefcase and one bag of "stuff", and when I left, I did the same. That said, this morning I looked at the bookcase in my home office and wondered what I'd do with the few books I purchased that are LONG outdated. Keeping with my "don't buy" mantra, there's only 5: Microsoft C Programming for the PC XML for Dummies Learn ASP.NET in 21 Days (probably v1) Professional C# 2008 Professional WordPress (probably v2) Is there any value in books this old? WordPress is probably 12 yo and it's the youngest. ASP and XML are circa 2000, and C is circa 1990. I hate to toss them in the landfill but can't figure out a use for them.
Old books are of two general types: 1. Programming-language specific 2. Language-agnostic like Algorithms, Maths, OS theory, etc. Type 2 books are less likely to have expiry dates, IMHO. (Of course, fiction, history, etc. books are of a different realm altogether).
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MarkTJohnson wrote:
Bequeath them in your will, let your ancestors descendants deal with what to do with them.
FTFY. I think your ancestors have even less use for your old books than you do. :-)
I always get that wrong. Thank you. Thinking like Merlin, aging backwards.
I’ve given up trying to be calm. However, I am open to feeling slightly less agitated. I’m begging you for the benefit of everyone, don’t be STUPID.
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After eliminating valueless textbooks after graduating college, I made it a point to NOT buy technical books. Other folks may go to an extreme -- one guy I worked with had a bookcase 8' tall and 12' wide, literally overflowing with technical books. Each time he touched a new technology, he purchased at least 3 new books. When he moved offices, it took him 2 days to move all the books. Having spent 25+ years as a consultant/contractor, when I needed technical books, I talked the client into buying them. The same conversation was conducted repeatedly with each client: "You know you can't keep the books when your contract ends?" Yeah, that was actually the idea. I had no idea what the future would bring in terms of technology I would work with, so I'd talk the next client into buying what I need for that contract. Saved me money AND I didn't have to move the books. When I went into a client site for the first time, I carried my briefcase and one bag of "stuff", and when I left, I did the same. That said, this morning I looked at the bookcase in my home office and wondered what I'd do with the few books I purchased that are LONG outdated. Keeping with my "don't buy" mantra, there's only 5: Microsoft C Programming for the PC XML for Dummies Learn ASP.NET in 21 Days (probably v1) Professional C# 2008 Professional WordPress (probably v2) Is there any value in books this old? WordPress is probably 12 yo and it's the youngest. ASP and XML are circa 2000, and C is circa 1990. I hate to toss them in the landfill but can't figure out a use for them.
Over the last several years I have thinned my herd of technical books quite a bit. Here at work I have about 18 inches of shelf. At home it's about half a dozen volumes, a couple of college textbooks from 40 years ago plus some 'work' technical stuff. I recently dumped a couple boxes of technical books I had stored at home. MS-DOS references, internals, and undocumented stuff. I used a lot of this back in the 90's at work.
Software Zen:
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After eliminating valueless textbooks after graduating college, I made it a point to NOT buy technical books. Other folks may go to an extreme -- one guy I worked with had a bookcase 8' tall and 12' wide, literally overflowing with technical books. Each time he touched a new technology, he purchased at least 3 new books. When he moved offices, it took him 2 days to move all the books. Having spent 25+ years as a consultant/contractor, when I needed technical books, I talked the client into buying them. The same conversation was conducted repeatedly with each client: "You know you can't keep the books when your contract ends?" Yeah, that was actually the idea. I had no idea what the future would bring in terms of technology I would work with, so I'd talk the next client into buying what I need for that contract. Saved me money AND I didn't have to move the books. When I went into a client site for the first time, I carried my briefcase and one bag of "stuff", and when I left, I did the same. That said, this morning I looked at the bookcase in my home office and wondered what I'd do with the few books I purchased that are LONG outdated. Keeping with my "don't buy" mantra, there's only 5: Microsoft C Programming for the PC XML for Dummies Learn ASP.NET in 21 Days (probably v1) Professional C# 2008 Professional WordPress (probably v2) Is there any value in books this old? WordPress is probably 12 yo and it's the youngest. ASP and XML are circa 2000, and C is circa 1990. I hate to toss them in the landfill but can't figure out a use for them.
They are great for target practice. My in-laws would shoot various guns on Thanksgiving day -- mostly we shot clay pigeons (20 gauge and 12 gauge) but they would also haul out other guns - .44 handgun, other various rifles etc. But often they would say, "well, let's just shoot at that twig down there about 30 yards" It was terribly un-fun that way. I started taking my old tech books and place 4 or 5 in front of each other. That was a blast (literally) as you could track the bullet through the pages of the book. So cool! Great Science I remember they were shooting a hollow point out of the .44 pistol and the bullet hole was perfectly round on entry and halfway through an 800 page tech book but then somehwere around page 400 or so the bullet mis-formed and ripped a huge hole through the rest of the book. So, use your old tech books for target practice.
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Old books are of two general types: 1. Programming-language specific 2. Language-agnostic like Algorithms, Maths, OS theory, etc. Type 2 books are less likely to have expiry dates, IMHO. (Of course, fiction, history, etc. books are of a different realm altogether).
Amarnath S wrote:
Language-agnostic like Algorithms, Maths, OS theory, etc
So, like, for instance, The Art of Computer Programming, Vol. 1: Fundamental Algorithms, 3rd Edition[^] by Donald Knuth But, I think that book has expired. I wonder if anyone has really read even half of it in the past 15 years? Probably not. But I'm jaded.
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Last year I threw away books from that era covering similar topics. One I remember buying and then reading, and it went way over my head (I was in my early teens and had a hard time already understanding books written in English, let alone the subject matter). I went back to it years later, and (re-)discovered interrupt programming. Then it turned out for years to be one of my favorite books. I also had about half a dozen OS/2 books - one with a foreword from Bill Gates.
I remember running OS/2 2.x quite some time before Win95 released. It was quite amazing to see true pre-emptive multitasking when all we really had was cooperative multitasking in the Windows 3 world. Then Win95 released and OS/2 continued the issues of no driver development (your CD-ROM didn't work in OS/2 bec their weren't any drivers for it) and win95 killed OS/2 and OS/2 killed itself. :rolleyes:
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I have zero nostalgia with paper books, especially technical books. (with some exceptions) I moved houses too many times with too many cases of books. I've recycled most of them and gave a few. I still have a small bookshelf with 2 dozen dusty books.
CI/CD = Continuous Impediment/Continuous Despair
Maximilien wrote:
I moved houses too many times with too many cases of books.
Yep, moving is what did me in too. I had some books when I started out, then gradually each time I moved I was like, "Why am I carrying these bricks made of paper all over the world?" I sold all of them (except a few nostalgia pieces) to Half Price Books and stopped breaking my back. Now I haven't moved for over 6 years & don't intend too. But I'm much tidier. :laugh:
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After eliminating valueless textbooks after graduating college, I made it a point to NOT buy technical books. Other folks may go to an extreme -- one guy I worked with had a bookcase 8' tall and 12' wide, literally overflowing with technical books. Each time he touched a new technology, he purchased at least 3 new books. When he moved offices, it took him 2 days to move all the books. Having spent 25+ years as a consultant/contractor, when I needed technical books, I talked the client into buying them. The same conversation was conducted repeatedly with each client: "You know you can't keep the books when your contract ends?" Yeah, that was actually the idea. I had no idea what the future would bring in terms of technology I would work with, so I'd talk the next client into buying what I need for that contract. Saved me money AND I didn't have to move the books. When I went into a client site for the first time, I carried my briefcase and one bag of "stuff", and when I left, I did the same. That said, this morning I looked at the bookcase in my home office and wondered what I'd do with the few books I purchased that are LONG outdated. Keeping with my "don't buy" mantra, there's only 5: Microsoft C Programming for the PC XML for Dummies Learn ASP.NET in 21 Days (probably v1) Professional C# 2008 Professional WordPress (probably v2) Is there any value in books this old? WordPress is probably 12 yo and it's the youngest. ASP and XML are circa 2000, and C is circa 1990. I hate to toss them in the landfill but can't figure out a use for them.
I bought very few books. The "treasured" ones are from a very long time ago; 6502 programming, manuals for UK101 etc. A bigger problem for me, now acting as several inches of loft insulation, are user manuals and course materials that I wrote, for various software vendors. Can't chuck them as probably the only copies still in existence! 😂
Telegraph marker posts ... nothing to do with IT Phasmid email discussion group ... also nothing to do with IT Beekeeping and honey site ... still nothing to do with IT
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After eliminating valueless textbooks after graduating college, I made it a point to NOT buy technical books. Other folks may go to an extreme -- one guy I worked with had a bookcase 8' tall and 12' wide, literally overflowing with technical books. Each time he touched a new technology, he purchased at least 3 new books. When he moved offices, it took him 2 days to move all the books. Having spent 25+ years as a consultant/contractor, when I needed technical books, I talked the client into buying them. The same conversation was conducted repeatedly with each client: "You know you can't keep the books when your contract ends?" Yeah, that was actually the idea. I had no idea what the future would bring in terms of technology I would work with, so I'd talk the next client into buying what I need for that contract. Saved me money AND I didn't have to move the books. When I went into a client site for the first time, I carried my briefcase and one bag of "stuff", and when I left, I did the same. That said, this morning I looked at the bookcase in my home office and wondered what I'd do with the few books I purchased that are LONG outdated. Keeping with my "don't buy" mantra, there's only 5: Microsoft C Programming for the PC XML for Dummies Learn ASP.NET in 21 Days (probably v1) Professional C# 2008 Professional WordPress (probably v2) Is there any value in books this old? WordPress is probably 12 yo and it's the youngest. ASP and XML are circa 2000, and C is circa 1990. I hate to toss them in the landfill but can't figure out a use for them.
BryanFazekas wrote:
Is there any value in books this old? WordPress is probably 12 yo and it's the youngest. ASP and XML are circa 2000, and C is circa 1990.
Yes, for historical purposes. But, not in physical format. You never know when you'll need it. Yes it's outdated tech, but for studying history it's nice to get context. Unless you know for certain you'll never, ever use that tech again. If there are eBook versions, get those and recycle the paper version if you don't want to lug it around. It'll be searchable too. If there aren't any eBook versions, consider making an eBook out of them. There are machines that'll take care of the grunt work for you. You can use a book scanning service. Sometimes, just sometimes, you want info that's out of print. Like when MSDN dumped all their Win32 info after .NET came out.
Jeremy Falcon
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They are great for target practice. My in-laws would shoot various guns on Thanksgiving day -- mostly we shot clay pigeons (20 gauge and 12 gauge) but they would also haul out other guns - .44 handgun, other various rifles etc. But often they would say, "well, let's just shoot at that twig down there about 30 yards" It was terribly un-fun that way. I started taking my old tech books and place 4 or 5 in front of each other. That was a blast (literally) as you could track the bullet through the pages of the book. So cool! Great Science I remember they were shooting a hollow point out of the .44 pistol and the bullet hole was perfectly round on entry and halfway through an 800 page tech book but then somehwere around page 400 or so the bullet mis-formed and ripped a huge hole through the rest of the book. So, use your old tech books for target practice.
Side note, bales of hay don't work so well for practice with a bow and arrow. The bale will start falling apart... :laugh:
Jeremy Falcon
