Micro$oft
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LOL John. Lets see, Intel, Maxtor, nVidia, MS, IBM are all bad guys because .... OMG ..... I HAD TO PAY MONEY FOR THEIR PRODUCTS!!!!!!!!! Tim Smith Descartes Systems Sciences, Inc.
I'm not saying that I mind paying for software, I'm saying it costs too damn much. With hardware, if you wait long enough, the price will drop (we can thank AMD for forcing Intel CPU's to start at more sane pricing levels than they used to). Not only that, but hardware has a longer shelf life than software. Lack of competition is the problem. To hell with those thin-skinned pillow-biters. - Me, 10/03/2001
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Damn straight Michael. If MS is kicked off the top spot, I will be moving to what makes me money! Tim Smith Descartes Systems Sciences, Inc.
Exactly - I program (mostly) for the money, not for the fun. I think I'll change my name in CodeProject to $owinski :-D Tomasz Sowinski -- http://www.shooltz.com
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Logical, well constructed arguements. Stayed on topic. No mention of goats, latex or guns. I voted "This helped".
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I voted "This helped". On which post? Michaels's or John's? :-D Tomasz Sowinski -- http://www.shooltz.com
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I voted "This helped". On which post? Michaels's or John's? :-D Tomasz Sowinski -- http://www.shooltz.com
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1. Linux developers are not poor. This is the real crime with Linux. They have managed to get a bunch of people to buy into this mantra while the top people are making a mint. 2. Free software is about the freedom, not the price. Actually, this is another lie. If you look at the GNU license, it is very very very restrictive. GNU != Freedom. I will never ever use GNU again. I am BSD all the way. 3. free software is forcing the Microsoft to give their software cheaper. So which is it? Free software is about freedom or price? Tim Smith Descartes Systems Sciences, Inc.
This is the real crime with Linux. They have managed to get a bunch of people to buy into this mantra while the top people are making a mint. Same with M$. Actually, this is another lie. If you look at the GNU license, it is very very very restrictive. GNU != Freedom. And did I say GNU? And it's not a lie - GNU is a problem only for those who would like to use the software but hide the source for some reason. Like a commercial company trying to use GNU but sell the binaries. GNU doesn't restrict the distribution of the source code - it enforces it. Don't like it - don't use it. Here is your freedom. So which is it? Free software is about freedom or price? It's about freedom, however having a freedom gives in a way a choice of getting it for free price, because you can get the code and compile it.
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I'm with you guys. My loyalty to MS extends no further than my next paycheck. "But, daddy, that was back in the hippie ages..." My twelve year old son - winning the argument. "Stan, you are an intelligent guy who responds in meaningful ways" Paul Watson 16/10/01
I'm with you guys. My loyalty to MS extends no further than my next paycheck. And here I was thinking you were in it for love Stan. Damn but I am disappointed, the Elders have strayed from the path. What hope have I? :laugh: Michael Martin Pegasystems Pty Ltd Australia martm@pegasystems.com +61 413-004-018 "Don't belong. Never join. Think for yourself. Peace" - Victor Stone
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I'm not saying that I mind paying for software, I'm saying it costs too damn much. With hardware, if you wait long enough, the price will drop (we can thank AMD for forcing Intel CPU's to start at more sane pricing levels than they used to). Not only that, but hardware has a longer shelf life than software. Lack of competition is the problem. To hell with those thin-skinned pillow-biters. - Me, 10/03/2001
With hardware, if you wait long enough, the price will drop It's the same with software: MS-DOS 6.22 and Windows 3.11 are pretty damn cheap now! :-D Foot-and-Mouth disease is believed to be the first virus unable to spread through Microsoft Outlook
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Logical, well constructed arguements. Stayed on topic. No mention of goats, latex or guns. I voted "This helped".
Get RadVC today! Play RAD in VC++ http://www.capitolsoft.com
LOL! cheers, Chris Maunder (CodeProject)
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I’ve seen this a lot in anti Microsoft sites (like Slashdot) or generally not-so-friendly MS sites (like ZDNet), whenever anything related to Microsoft is mentioned, the letter 'S' being transformed magically into a yummy dollar sign ('$'), such as Micro$oft, M$, M$FT, Window$ … I can understand why an anti-Microsoftie like a Linux zealot would use this sign. Something like the following probably go in their minds about Microsoft when they use the sign.. “A monopoli$t company that $uck$ poor($) Window$ users' hard earned money ($) and makes its founder the richest($) person of the world and thus in turn making us, the Linux developers even poorer($), by forcing us to give away our fine software for free($)….” Now that’s understood, but I wonder why loyal Windows developers in a Microsoft friendly site like this need to decorate the ‘S’ letter (see the comments in this article for proof). Does this mean that we’re not as loyal as Microsoft expects us to be, or has it become a fashion to use this decoration to attract others’ attention? Hmm.. How about a genuine reason that can go something like this.. “Micro$oft is fine company that believe$ in innovation and free market economy ($).. a company that helps us keep surviving ($) and even help some of us make big bucks ($) by providing licen$e to develop on a fine operating system we all know as Window$” Hmm, any other thought? // Fazlul
Get RadVC today! Play RAD in VC++ http://www.capitolsoft.com
IMHO a lot of us Micro$oft advocates simply use and evangilise their products because they are very good. Their development tools cannot be beaten, their OS is pretty damned good (especially on the desktop were no other contender is at all competitive), their Office suite is powerful and basically a standard, their browser is excellent and finally they provide a lot of resources, tools, information etc. to us developers which makes developing a charm. Speaking for myself I do not like MS's corporate tactics but then neither do I like BP harming the environment, but I still buy petrol from them. Shoes from Nike who exploit child labour, same thing. I use MS because they earn me a living. I sometimes use M$ beacause they deserve a good ribbing. (hey that rhymes!). If there was a competitor level on the playing field to MS that was ethically more sound then I would use them. But there isn't. There is one thing though that I actually am very impressed and excited about in MS: It is their vision. No other company has the vision and power that they do. regards, Paul Watson Bluegrass Cape Town, South Africa "The greatest thing you will ever learn is to love, and be loved in return" - Moulin Rouge "In other words, the developer is dealing with an elephant, the accountant is dealing with a bunny rabbit." by Stan Shannon - 16/10/2001
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IMHO a lot of us Micro$oft advocates simply use and evangilise their products because they are very good. Their development tools cannot be beaten, their OS is pretty damned good (especially on the desktop were no other contender is at all competitive), their Office suite is powerful and basically a standard, their browser is excellent and finally they provide a lot of resources, tools, information etc. to us developers which makes developing a charm. Speaking for myself I do not like MS's corporate tactics but then neither do I like BP harming the environment, but I still buy petrol from them. Shoes from Nike who exploit child labour, same thing. I use MS because they earn me a living. I sometimes use M$ beacause they deserve a good ribbing. (hey that rhymes!). If there was a competitor level on the playing field to MS that was ethically more sound then I would use them. But there isn't. There is one thing though that I actually am very impressed and excited about in MS: It is their vision. No other company has the vision and power that they do. regards, Paul Watson Bluegrass Cape Town, South Africa "The greatest thing you will ever learn is to love, and be loved in return" - Moulin Rouge "In other words, the developer is dealing with an elephant, the accountant is dealing with a bunny rabbit." by Stan Shannon - 16/10/2001
There is one thing though that I actually am very impressed and excited about in MS: It is their vision. No other company has the vision and power that they do. Yeah, if only I had eaten all those carrots when I was younger like my mother told me. Then we'd see who had vision. None of this short-sighted shit I tell you, none of it. ;P Michael Martin Pegasystems Pty Ltd Australia martm@pegasystems.com +61 413-004-018 "Don't belong. Never join. Think for yourself. Peace" - Victor Stone
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I’ve seen this a lot in anti Microsoft sites (like Slashdot) or generally not-so-friendly MS sites (like ZDNet), whenever anything related to Microsoft is mentioned, the letter 'S' being transformed magically into a yummy dollar sign ('$'), such as Micro$oft, M$, M$FT, Window$ … I can understand why an anti-Microsoftie like a Linux zealot would use this sign. Something like the following probably go in their minds about Microsoft when they use the sign.. “A monopoli$t company that $uck$ poor($) Window$ users' hard earned money ($) and makes its founder the richest($) person of the world and thus in turn making us, the Linux developers even poorer($), by forcing us to give away our fine software for free($)….” Now that’s understood, but I wonder why loyal Windows developers in a Microsoft friendly site like this need to decorate the ‘S’ letter (see the comments in this article for proof). Does this mean that we’re not as loyal as Microsoft expects us to be, or has it become a fashion to use this decoration to attract others’ attention? Hmm.. How about a genuine reason that can go something like this.. “Micro$oft is fine company that believe$ in innovation and free market economy ($).. a company that helps us keep surviving ($) and even help some of us make big bucks ($) by providing licen$e to develop on a fine operating system we all know as Window$” Hmm, any other thought? // Fazlul
Get RadVC today! Play RAD in VC++ http://www.capitolsoft.com
I hate this f....d eternal MS-Linux discussions! Go make your money; whatever you use! :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:
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Logical, well constructed arguements. Stayed on topic. No mention of goats, latex or guns. Have you been hacked again John? Or are you taking your medication? :-D Michael Martin Pegasystems Pty Ltd Australia martm@pegasystems.com +61 413-004-018 "Don't belong. Never join. Think for yourself. Peace" - Victor Stone
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I hate this f....d eternal MS-Linux discussions! Go make your money; whatever you use! :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:
I don't believe that this was a MS vs Linux arguement. Fazlul was merely asking why people would use an anti-Microsoft term on a Microsoft developer site. Thought the question was valid myself, even though I don't see a problem with using it. Michael Martin Pegasystems Pty Ltd Australia martm@pegasystems.com +61 413-004-018 "Don't belong. Never join. Think for yourself. Peace" - Victor Stone
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IMHO a lot of us Micro$oft advocates simply use and evangilise their products because they are very good. Their development tools cannot be beaten, their OS is pretty damned good (especially on the desktop were no other contender is at all competitive), their Office suite is powerful and basically a standard, their browser is excellent and finally they provide a lot of resources, tools, information etc. to us developers which makes developing a charm. Speaking for myself I do not like MS's corporate tactics but then neither do I like BP harming the environment, but I still buy petrol from them. Shoes from Nike who exploit child labour, same thing. I use MS because they earn me a living. I sometimes use M$ beacause they deserve a good ribbing. (hey that rhymes!). If there was a competitor level on the playing field to MS that was ethically more sound then I would use them. But there isn't. There is one thing though that I actually am very impressed and excited about in MS: It is their vision. No other company has the vision and power that they do. regards, Paul Watson Bluegrass Cape Town, South Africa "The greatest thing you will ever learn is to love, and be loved in return" - Moulin Rouge "In other words, the developer is dealing with an elephant, the accountant is dealing with a bunny rabbit." by Stan Shannon - 16/10/2001
"The greatest thing you will ever learn is to love, and be loved in return" Eden Ahbez, 1948 (?). From the song "Nature Boy". This song was made famous in the 50's by Nat King Cole and since covered by everyone from John Coltrane to Big Star. I plan to cover it myself someday. :) -c
Smaller Animals Software, Inc. http://www.smalleranimals.com
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"The greatest thing you will ever learn is to love, and be loved in return" Eden Ahbez, 1948 (?). From the song "Nature Boy". This song was made famous in the 50's by Nat King Cole and since covered by everyone from John Coltrane to Big Star. I plan to cover it myself someday. :) -c
Smaller Animals Software, Inc. http://www.smalleranimals.com
"The greatest thing you will ever learn is to love, and be loved in return" Eden Ahbez, 1948 (?). From the song "Nature Boy". This song was made famous in the 50's by Nat King Cole and since covered by everyone from John Coltrane to Big Star. Wow, I did not know that. Thanks for telling me that Chris :) I got it from Moulin Rouge, the movie. I plan to cover it myself someday What "type" of musician are you? And if you do send on over a sample (or were we can buy the CD single) so that we can have a listen :) regards, Paul Watson Bluegrass Cape Town, South Africa "The greatest thing you will ever learn is to love, and be loved in return" - Moulin Rouge "In other words, the developer is dealing with an elephant, the accountant is dealing with a bunny rabbit." by Stan Shannon - 16/10/2001
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I hate this f....d eternal MS-Linux discussions! Go make your money; whatever you use! :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:
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Man, who pissed in your Wheaties this morning? To hell with those thin-skinned pillow-biters. - Me, 10/03/2001
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I'm with you guys. My loyalty to MS extends no further than my next paycheck. And here I was thinking you were in it for love Stan. Damn but I am disappointed, the Elders have strayed from the path. What hope have I? :laugh: Michael Martin Pegasystems Pty Ltd Australia martm@pegasystems.com +61 413-004-018 "Don't belong. Never join. Think for yourself. Peace" - Victor Stone
I just hope MS stays on top long enough for me to retire - just so I don't have to completely revamp all my skills *again* just to get my kids through college. After that, I hope they up-chuck-and-die. "But, daddy, that was back in the hippie ages..." My twelve year old son - winning the argument. "Stan, you are an intelligent guy who responds in meaningful ways" Paul Watson 16/10/01
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You seem to be ignorant in the Open Source matter. 1. Linux developers are not poor. They make a good money and they can afford to make some software for fun and give it for free. Unix/Linux jobs can pay much better than a Windows jobs pretty often, specially if you count all those cheap VB and C# programmers into the pool to count awerage. 2. Free software is about the freedom, not the price. You are allowed to charge for the distribution, support, consultancy, transfer media, whatever. But you can't charge for the software(that is source code) itself - because software is free (but not always free of charge). If you make a changes - you have to show them and often mark those. No hidden API and other dirty tricks we've all seen from Microsoft. 3. It's actually the other way round - free software is forcing the Microsoft to give their software cheaper.
>> You are allowed to charge for the distribution, support, consultancy, transfer media, whatever. Sounds pretty much like "Software as a Service" to me... >> cheap VB and C# programmers How many "Looking for a C# programmer" ads have you seen lately? >> It's actually the other way round - free software is forcing the Microsoft to give their software cheaper. Hopefuly - but doesn't look like, now, does it? Peter
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That's the fact! It's allways the same: Winodws - Linux!!!!
You're delusional, dude. This article wasn't about Linux vs Windows. The original author was curious as to why Windows developers (with an assumed loyalty to Microsoft) would use the same subtle insult made popular by admitted anti-Windows advocates. Do you have a problem with actually *reading* the words, or do you have a problem *comprehending* what you read? The reason I asked is because I want to make sure I target the more correct description of your mental deficiency before I start making fun of it. To hell with those thin-skinned pillow-biters. - Me, 10/03/2001
