Very Interesting Read
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Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh yes absolutely you are sooo right. The world is totally OK and we don't have to change a thing about how we behave with it. In fact we should all do more and more. Lets drill in Alaska to feed the greed of American car drivers for their giant SUVs. Lets chop down the rain forests to grow cows for McDonalds to feed people with so the big drug companies can sell them drugs to keep them alive. Of course lets not help people in Africa or India with AIDS because they are too poor to make a profit from. But no you are right. Lets just sit here and play word games and prove each other semantically right or semantically wrong. Like I said before. Bleh! X|
fakefur wrote: Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh yes absolutely you are sooo right. The world is totally OK and we don't have to change a thing about how we behave with it. In fact we should all do more and more. Lets drill in Alaska to feed the greed of American car drivers for their giant SUVs. Lets chop down the rain forests to grow cows for McDonalds to feed people with so the big drug companies can sell them drugs to keep them alive. Of course lets not help people in Africa or India with AIDS because they are too poor to make a profit from. You aren't actually reading my replies, are you? You're just greping them for keywords, right? fakefur wrote: But no you are right. Lets just sit here and play word games and prove each other semantically right or semantically wrong. No, that would be a pointless waste of time. Similar to how trying to win people over to your point of view by throwing insults at them is a pointless waste of time. There's a name for people who start discussions with no intention of actually presenting a coherent argument, but every intention of spewing vitriol at those who do not immediately bend to their (indecipherable) point of view....
Shog9
I'm not the Jack of Diamonds... I'm not the six of spades. I don't know what you thought; I'm not your astronaut...
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Shog9 wrote: Good evening, Mr. Pot. My name is Kettle. Pleased to meet you. Who is Mr. Pot/Kettle? :-D sorry for OT, but is it some common saying or something? David Never forget: "Stay kul and happy" (I.A.)
David's thoughts / dnhsoftware.org / MyHTMLTidyThe common saying is: the pot calling the kettle black, which refers to a person who criticizes faults in others that he also has.
Shog9
I'm not the Jack of Diamonds... I'm not the six of spades. I don't know what you thought; I'm not your astronaut...
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Shog9 wrote: Good evening, Mr. Pot. My name is Kettle. Pleased to meet you. Who is Mr. Pot/Kettle? :-D sorry for OT, but is it some common saying or something? David Never forget: "Stay kul and happy" (I.A.)
David's thoughts / dnhsoftware.org / MyHTMLTidydnh wrote: Who is Mr. Pot/Kettle? :-D sorry for OT, but is it some common saying or something? It is an old saying, "That's like the pot calling the kettle black". Old style cooking pots and kettles (used to boil water for tea/coffee/etc) that hung over fires were black. The saying can be used (I know this but am finding it so hard to explain now) when someone is argueing a point. They claim something of the other person (like they're a bigot) while they themselves have the same or a different bigotry. They are calling the other person something that they also are. So the saying about the pot calling the kettle black. Michael Martin Australia "I controlled my laughter and simple said "No,I am very busy,so I can't write any code for you". The moment they heard this all the smiling face turned into a sad looking face and one of them farted. So i had to leave the place as soon as possible." - Mr.Prakash 24/04/2004
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The common saying is: the pot calling the kettle black, which refers to a person who criticizes faults in others that he also has.
Shog9
I'm not the Jack of Diamonds... I'm not the six of spades. I don't know what you thought; I'm not your astronaut...
Ah, I see. Thanks. David Never forget: "Stay kul and happy" (I.A.)
David's thoughts / dnhsoftware.org / MyHTMLTidy -
dnh wrote: Who is Mr. Pot/Kettle? :-D sorry for OT, but is it some common saying or something? It is an old saying, "That's like the pot calling the kettle black". Old style cooking pots and kettles (used to boil water for tea/coffee/etc) that hung over fires were black. The saying can be used (I know this but am finding it so hard to explain now) when someone is argueing a point. They claim something of the other person (like they're a bigot) while they themselves have the same or a different bigotry. They are calling the other person something that they also are. So the saying about the pot calling the kettle black. Michael Martin Australia "I controlled my laughter and simple said "No,I am very busy,so I can't write any code for you". The moment they heard this all the smiling face turned into a sad looking face and one of them farted. So i had to leave the place as soon as possible." - Mr.Prakash 24/04/2004
Thank you for explanation! David Never forget: "Stay kul and happy" (I.A.)
David's thoughts / dnhsoftware.org / MyHTMLTidy -
Ohhhhhh I see - the opinions of that many scientists around the world is unimportant and not to be taken seriously because someone called Chris says a book that says "Everything Is OK" is a good read? People like you are why the world is like it is Bleh This site sucks
It's called having a balanced opinion, and if you do some research you will find that many other scientists say the claims of the doomsayers are wrong, misreported or based on faulty research. If we had one body of scientists who were always right then the world would be a simpler place. cheers, Chris Maunder
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Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh yes absolutely you are sooo right. The world is totally OK and we don't have to change a thing about how we behave with it. In fact we should all do more and more. Lets drill in Alaska to feed the greed of American car drivers for their giant SUVs. Lets chop down the rain forests to grow cows for McDonalds to feed people with so the big drug companies can sell them drugs to keep them alive. Of course lets not help people in Africa or India with AIDS because they are too poor to make a profit from. But no you are right. Lets just sit here and play word games and prove each other semantically right or semantically wrong. Like I said before. Bleh! X|
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Forgive me. You are right. This site does not suck. Some of the self-righteous people I seem to have come across just now are what sucks. FYI I'm a developer yes. I develop for Linux, Macs and Windows so I don't have any particular religious fundamentalism regarding platforms so please don't get started on that tired old tune. So Chris is an ex-scientist and his recomedation of a book is enough to out-weigh what over 1000 current scientists say is it? Surely not? Opinions are what we base most of our lives on without proof no? The general attitude here reminds me of Nero fiddlig while Rome burnt. That's what I meant when I said the world is like it is because of the kind of attitudes I see here.
fakefur wrote: So Chris is an ex-scientist and his recomedation of a book is enough to out-weigh what over 1000 current scientists say is it? Surely not? There are a lot of examples in history where one scientist was enough to out-weigh 1000 scientists believed. I see dead pixels Yes, even I am blogging now!
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It's called having a balanced opinion, and if you do some research you will find that many other scientists say the claims of the doomsayers are wrong, misreported or based on faulty research. If we had one body of scientists who were always right then the world would be a simpler place. cheers, Chris Maunder
Chris Maunder wrote: If we had one body of scientists who were always right... Well I'm not a scientist.....but. Michael Martin Australia "I controlled my laughter and simple said "No,I am very busy,so I can't write any code for you". The moment they heard this all the smiling face turned into a sad looking face and one of them farted. So i had to leave the place as soon as possible." - Mr.Prakash 24/04/2004
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Haing just read Bjorn Lomborg's excellent book on Chris' recommendation, I say: Hogwash. http://www.lomborg.com/books.htm[^] David
I think you crashed their server, Dave. Here's the link on Amazon: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0521010683/theskepticale-20/002-9164680-2268855.
[Cheshire] I can't afford those plastic things to cover the electric sockets so I just draw bunny faces on the electric outlets to scare the kids away from them... [RLtim] Newsflash! Kids aren't afraid of bunnies. [Cheshire] Oh they will be... -Bash.org
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Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh yes absolutely you are sooo right. The world is totally OK and we don't have to change a thing about how we behave with it. In fact we should all do more and more. Lets drill in Alaska to feed the greed of American car drivers for their giant SUVs. Lets chop down the rain forests to grow cows for McDonalds to feed people with so the big drug companies can sell them drugs to keep them alive. Of course lets not help people in Africa or India with AIDS because they are too poor to make a profit from. But no you are right. Lets just sit here and play word games and prove each other semantically right or semantically wrong. Like I said before. Bleh! X|
fakefur wrote: chop down the rain forests Where exactly are they cutting down rain forests in order to 'grow cows' for McDonalds? fakefur wrote: drill in Alaska You mean in the tundra up there where basically nothing grows? You do realize that the pictures the environmentalist show is not where the oil is don't you? The pics generally show this beautiful mountain range full of flowers! That's not where they are planning on drilling. It's actually a tundra! fakefur wrote: lets not help people in Africa or India with AIDS because they are too poor to make a profit from I'd be willing to bet you that when Clinton was in office you were perfectly happy with the amount sent to Africa or anywhere else to fight aids. Wouldn't hear you complaining at all. But now that Bush is in office you are complaining. And Bush is way outspending Clinton in battling AIDS. ed ~"Watch your thoughts; they become your words. Watch your words they become your actions. Watch your actions; they become your habits. Watch your habits; they become your character. Watch your character; it becomes your destiny." -Frank Outlaw.
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The oil peak is something that is certain to come. It won't be the end of the world though, just means transportation gets very expensive... the important thing is when will it come. The estimate varies widely depending on the souce. The EIA is the most optimistic and estimates 2037, while in that artical it says it comes in the next few years. Most reports are exagerated one way or the other, according to political interests. The EIA don't want investors to panic, so they give a rosy outlook, while the enviromentalists want people to start conserving.
One thing that isn't often mentioned is that the oil reserves start filling back up. No doubt we are using it fast than the earth produces it or at least what we have access to. But regardless, until there is economic demand for a better/different mode of transportation that is more efficient we aren't going to get it. No demand...no product! But with the trend here in the US with prices skyrocketing I'm looking forward to some innovation sooner than later! I hope anyways!! Tired of looking for a carpool! ed ~"Watch your thoughts; they become your words. Watch your words they become your actions. Watch your actions; they become your habits. Watch your habits; they become your character. Watch your character; it becomes your destiny." -Frank Outlaw.
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fakefur wrote: Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh yes absolutely you are sooo right. The world is totally OK and we don't have to change a thing about how we behave with it. In fact we should all do more and more. Lets drill in Alaska to feed the greed of American car drivers for their giant SUVs. Lets chop down the rain forests to grow cows for McDonalds to feed people with so the big drug companies can sell them drugs to keep them alive. Of course lets not help people in Africa or India with AIDS because they are too poor to make a profit from. You aren't actually reading my replies, are you? You're just greping them for keywords, right? fakefur wrote: But no you are right. Lets just sit here and play word games and prove each other semantically right or semantically wrong. No, that would be a pointless waste of time. Similar to how trying to win people over to your point of view by throwing insults at them is a pointless waste of time. There's a name for people who start discussions with no intention of actually presenting a coherent argument, but every intention of spewing vitriol at those who do not immediately bend to their (indecipherable) point of view....
Shog9
I'm not the Jack of Diamonds... I'm not the six of spades. I don't know what you thought; I'm not your astronaut...
Actually yes I am reading what you write so no I'm not grep'ing them for keywords I'm not trying to win anybody over to my point of view. All I said was "Very Interesting Read". So I would say back to you that you are not reading what I write. As far as I see I am presenting valid reasoned arguments. It is the replies Im getting that are neither valid or reasoned. To say that 1000+ scientists are fabricating a report that criticises the policies of the developed world when it comes to how the world is treated is ridiculous. What would they have to gain by doing such a thing? Are they selling anything? Are they protecting a status quo? No It is the attitudes I have seen here that seem to be trying to protect a status quo that has managed to bring this earth the edge of ruin in the space of 100 years or so. But as I said you are right. Lets not discuss actual issues. Lets just call each other names and cry foul when someone says something that isn't popular with the "consumer" mentality. I have to say it but without in any way supporting or agreeing with terrorism in any way shape or form this attitude is a large part of the reason why Americans are so disliked around the world currently.
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Actually yes I am reading what you write so no I'm not grep'ing them for keywords I'm not trying to win anybody over to my point of view. All I said was "Very Interesting Read". So I would say back to you that you are not reading what I write. As far as I see I am presenting valid reasoned arguments. It is the replies Im getting that are neither valid or reasoned. To say that 1000+ scientists are fabricating a report that criticises the policies of the developed world when it comes to how the world is treated is ridiculous. What would they have to gain by doing such a thing? Are they selling anything? Are they protecting a status quo? No It is the attitudes I have seen here that seem to be trying to protect a status quo that has managed to bring this earth the edge of ruin in the space of 100 years or so. But as I said you are right. Lets not discuss actual issues. Lets just call each other names and cry foul when someone says something that isn't popular with the "consumer" mentality. I have to say it but without in any way supporting or agreeing with terrorism in any way shape or form this attitude is a large part of the reason why Americans are so disliked around the world currently.
fakefur wrote: Actually yes I am reading what you write so no I'm not grep'ing them for keywords Then you'll realize that i haven't actually stated my opinion on the subject. The reason being, i realize that it isn't worth jack! I don't keep up on such reports, so i have only a partial picture of what's going on, at best. I'd state my opinion of the article, but this really isn't the proper forum. fakefur wrote: I'm not trying to win anybody over to my point of view. All I said was "Very Interesting Read". Hmm...
fakefur wrote (to Rob Graham): Are you the arbiter of this forum? fakefur wrote (to Rob Graham): Really pathetic fakefur wrote (to David Cunningham): People like you are why the world is like it is fakefur wrote (to dnh): The general attitude here reminds me of Nero fiddlig while Rome burnt. fakefur wrote (to me): Bleh!
No, it really looks like you've been saying a lot more than just "Very Interesting Read". fakefur wrote: As far as I see I am presenting valid reasoned arguments. And you're entitled to your opinion! but it's wrong. ;) fakefur wrote: To say that 1000+ scientists are fabricating a report that criticises the policies of the developed world when it comes to how the world is treated is ridiculous. Ah, but there's the trick - criticism can come from a lot of places, for a lot of reasons! For instance, i'm criticising you for your debating tactics, here and now. But this says nothing about your coding abilities, my opinion of them, or even my awareness of them. Context is everything. fakefur wrote: But as I said you are right. And i strongly suspect you're being sarcastic. fakefur wrote: I have to say it but without in any way supporting or agreeing with terrorism in any way shape or form this attitude is a large part of the reason why Americans are so disliked around the world currently. Yeah, we're all a bunch of little Eichmanns, aren't we! :D
Shog9
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BTW, You're kidding right. Read the book. The last 100 pages of the book provide 2900 solid footnotes to facts, facts that are internationally recognized, and Lomborg systematically disects most of the propoganda put out by the environmental movement in the last 15-20 years. Are there things we need to work on, yes absolutely deforestation in poor nations is one I'm personally passionate about and I think the rich nations should put their money where their mouths are and compensate the poor nations for not cutting down forests. Does anyone, anywhere need to be pushing the panic button? I don't think so. How long can the currently identified Oil reserves last us at current consumption levels? If we are willing to pay an average price of $40 US a barrel they'll last 5000 years. David
David Cunningham wrote: How long can the currently identified Oil reserves last us at current consumption levels? If we are willing to pay an average price of $40 US a barrel they'll last 5000 years. I doubt your facts here. This[^]source may be biased, but is consitent with others I've seen - perhaps even a bit conservative in its estimates of consumption rates : 928 Gigabarrels of 'known' reserves , 10 Gigabarrels of new resevers discovered every year, 29 gb consumed every year = net loss of 19 gb/yr assuming constant consumption and discovery rates (actually consumption is growing by ~1 gb/yr). That works out to 928/19 = ~49 years before all is consumed. It will be a crisis long before that, since as scarcity increases so will price. Oil drives prices for not only energy but also drugs, chemicals and plastics, all of which it is a raw material for. Most of the stuff in article cited was alarmist bunk (Chicken Little stuff), but the oil crisis is real and looming. We must soon find and make practicle alternate energy sources. Oil won't be affordable (as a fuel) for our great-grandchildren. Anger is the most impotent of passions. It effects nothing it goes about, and hurts the one who is possessed by it more than the one against whom it is directed. Carl Sandburg
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Why better in the Soap Box? Because you don't like the sentiment of the article? Are you the arbiter of this forum?
fakefur wrote: Why better in the Soap Box? Because you don't like the sentiment of the article? It was a polite suggestion that the subject might get more appropriate debate there. Your responses were neither polite nor justified. Anger is the most impotent of passions. It effects nothing it goes about, and hurts the one who is possessed by it more than the one against whom it is directed. Carl Sandburg
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I believe a lot of what is being said there is true ( although there's no reason for farmland to become 'used up', that's just bollocks ), but the author was far to hysterical for me to take it remotely seriously. Christian I have several lifelong friends that are New Yorkers but I have always gravitated toward the weirdo's. - Richard Stringer
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I defnititely believe that we aren't doing the best job at taking care of the environment of the planet, but chicken little articles like this do more to harm the casue then do good. There is no information in this article other then the 60% figure and that isn't even put in context.
I can imagine the sinking feeling one would have after ordering my book, only to find a laughably ridiculous theory with demented logic once the book arrives - Mark McCutcheon