Firefox's Slickest Features
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Dave Kreskowiak wrote:
And you wrote a compiler that uses this??
Yep. And we wrote it for Intel processors and Microsoft operating systems for the very same reason: ubiquitousness. None of these three would not be our first choice in an ideal world. But we do have plans to make the latter two go away (at least for us); I think we're stuck, however, with English for some time yet...
The Grand Negus wrote:
I think we're stuck, however, with English for some time yet...
Is that Australian English, Australian Aboriginal English, Queen's English, American English (formal or informal, they are different being college level and 6th grade respectively)? Southern Drawl? Texas Drawl? Great Lakes? Middle English? Early Middle English? African American Vernacular English? Pacific Northwest English? Utah English? Hawaiian English? Navajo English? New Orleans English? New Mexico English? Indian English? Do you have an adaption for King James? Shakespeare? You do realize that the improper use could provide a misunderstanding to the compiler that would create a bug. Therefore you should have a proper variation for all these and many more variations of the English language world-wide to prevent such bugs. Or warn the user that regional variations in English have thus been removed from historical reference and only the American informal (aka elementary school education) is accepted and all other countries can sod off.
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
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I'd be curious to know if you've ever read any of David Berlinski's stuff and, if you have, what you think of it.
The Grand Negus wrote:
David Berlinski'
that is easy, your persistence is proof he is wrong.
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
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The Grand Negus wrote:
I think we're stuck, however, with English for some time yet...
Is that Australian English, Australian Aboriginal English, Queen's English, American English (formal or informal, they are different being college level and 6th grade respectively)? Southern Drawl? Texas Drawl? Great Lakes? Middle English? Early Middle English? African American Vernacular English? Pacific Northwest English? Utah English? Hawaiian English? Navajo English? New Orleans English? New Mexico English? Indian English? Do you have an adaption for King James? Shakespeare? You do realize that the improper use could provide a misunderstanding to the compiler that would create a bug. Therefore you should have a proper variation for all these and many more variations of the English language world-wide to prevent such bugs. Or warn the user that regional variations in English have thus been removed from historical reference and only the American informal (aka elementary school education) is accepted and all other countries can sod off.
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
Jeffry J. Brickley wrote:
Is that Australian English, Australian Aboriginal English, Queen's English, American English (formal or informal, they are different being college level and 6th grade respectively)? Southern Drawl? Texas Drawl? Great Lakes? Middle English? Early Middle English? African American Vernacular English? Pacific Northwest English? Utah English? Hawaiian English? Navajo English? New Orleans English? New Mexico English? Indian English? Do you have an adaption for King James? Shakespeare?
Even if he accounted for those, that would still leave out the Irish with their own variation of grammar. He might have to pay Paul a large consulting fee to be able to handle it. Roswell:laugh:
"Angelinos -- excuse me. There will be civility today."
Antonio VillaRaigosa
City Mayor, Los Angeles, CA -
The Grand Negus wrote:
I think we're stuck, however, with English for some time yet...
Is that Australian English, Australian Aboriginal English, Queen's English, American English (formal or informal, they are different being college level and 6th grade respectively)? Southern Drawl? Texas Drawl? Great Lakes? Middle English? Early Middle English? African American Vernacular English? Pacific Northwest English? Utah English? Hawaiian English? Navajo English? New Orleans English? New Mexico English? Indian English? Do you have an adaption for King James? Shakespeare? You do realize that the improper use could provide a misunderstanding to the compiler that would create a bug. Therefore you should have a proper variation for all these and many more variations of the English language world-wide to prevent such bugs. Or warn the user that regional variations in English have thus been removed from historical reference and only the American informal (aka elementary school education) is accepted and all other countries can sod off.
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
Jeffry J. Brickley wrote:
Is that Australian English, Australian Aboriginal English, Queen's English, American English... You do realize that the improper use could provide a misunderstanding to the compiler that would create a bug...
You're thinking much too mathematically again. When I say to my wife, "Hit the lights!" she knows what to do - even though that particular sentence is "Idiomatic English" (which was missing from your list!). The strength and beauty of our approach to language is that it is not, essentially, based on grammar or vocabulary. The machine understands what it's been taught to understand, spelling errors and grammatical mistakes notwithstanding. And when a PAL 3000 misunderstands, it's not a bug, it's typical of an "apparently intelligent"(tm) being. Like, again, my wife. "Not those lights, honey; the other ones." Believe it or not, our approach is designed to handle situations just like these, in the very ways that humans handle them. And since each user will be talking to his own PAL 3000 - brought up in that particular environment - each PAL will behave according to the cultural norms that apply.
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Jeffry J. Brickley wrote:
Is that Australian English, Australian Aboriginal English, Queen's English, American English... You do realize that the improper use could provide a misunderstanding to the compiler that would create a bug...
You're thinking much too mathematically again. When I say to my wife, "Hit the lights!" she knows what to do - even though that particular sentence is "Idiomatic English" (which was missing from your list!). The strength and beauty of our approach to language is that it is not, essentially, based on grammar or vocabulary. The machine understands what it's been taught to understand, spelling errors and grammatical mistakes notwithstanding. And when a PAL 3000 misunderstands, it's not a bug, it's typical of an "apparently intelligent"(tm) being. Like, again, my wife. "Not those lights, honey; the other ones." Believe it or not, our approach is designed to handle situations just like these, in the very ways that humans handle them. And since each user will be talking to his own PAL 3000 - brought up in that particular environment - each PAL will behave according to the cultural norms that apply.
The Grand Negus wrote:
Hit the lights
yes, she punches the light, slices her hand up and then is mad at you... or did she jump on the tread mill and run a straight away? or did she turn the lights on? or.... your wife knows what to only because you have a commonality, English is NOT that common.
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
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RoswellNX wrote:
Sir, what are you smoking?
I'm not sure I understand what you're saying. If you'd like a response, please clarify. Thanks.
The Grand Negus wrote:
If you'd like a response, please clarify.
what he spoke clear and direct english and you didn't understand??????? :laugh::laugh:
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
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"centric" does not mean "with absolute exclusion to all other ideas or technologies" imho
Todd Smith
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The Grand Negus wrote:
If you'd like a response, please clarify.
what he spoke clear and direct english and you didn't understand??????? :laugh::laugh:
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
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Jeffry J. Brickley wrote:
what he spoke clear and direct english and you didn't understand???????
No, she spoke clear and direct english and you didn't know it was a female.
The Grand Negus wrote:
No, she spoke clear and direct english and you didn't know it was a female.
but informal american english uses male as the generic, I thought you were the english expert here? :rolleyes: was there a misunderstanding using informal standard english? wow.... I knew she was female, we've tossed messages back and forth here before. But I knew you would ignore the standard and try for the formal english, which is not standard. But wait? you mean there are different englishes and confusion? who would ever have said that? :rolleyes:
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
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Jeffry J. Brickley wrote:
Is that Australian English, Australian Aboriginal English, Queen's English, American English... You do realize that the improper use could provide a misunderstanding to the compiler that would create a bug...
You're thinking much too mathematically again. When I say to my wife, "Hit the lights!" she knows what to do - even though that particular sentence is "Idiomatic English" (which was missing from your list!). The strength and beauty of our approach to language is that it is not, essentially, based on grammar or vocabulary. The machine understands what it's been taught to understand, spelling errors and grammatical mistakes notwithstanding. And when a PAL 3000 misunderstands, it's not a bug, it's typical of an "apparently intelligent"(tm) being. Like, again, my wife. "Not those lights, honey; the other ones." Believe it or not, our approach is designed to handle situations just like these, in the very ways that humans handle them. And since each user will be talking to his own PAL 3000 - brought up in that particular environment - each PAL will behave according to the cultural norms that apply.
The Grand Negus wrote:
each PAL will behave according to the cultural norms that apply
Brilliant. I pull some code from CVS that Bob wrote and my PAL 3000 has no idea how to compile it.
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The Grand Negus wrote:
No, she spoke clear and direct english and you didn't know it was a female.
but informal american english uses male as the generic, I thought you were the english expert here? :rolleyes: was there a misunderstanding using informal standard english? wow.... I knew she was female, we've tossed messages back and forth here before. But I knew you would ignore the standard and try for the formal english, which is not standard. But wait? you mean there are different englishes and confusion? who would ever have said that? :rolleyes:
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
It's all moot, Jeffry; we're not talking about the same thing. We Osmosians are not trying to build a computer - that's been done. We're trying to make a machine that understands language the way that people do - misunderstandings and all. We hope to gain some insights this way.
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It's all moot, Jeffry; we're not talking about the same thing. We Osmosians are not trying to build a computer - that's been done. We're trying to make a machine that understands language the way that people do - misunderstandings and all. We hope to gain some insights this way.
The Grand Negus wrote:
We hope to gain some insights this way.
so far you have not gained any, and we've all offered a lot. Your statement as always is you know the "right" way and everyone else is "wrong." Writing English that way will get you the worst of any English variation spoken to you... and yet you are always shocked that you are treated as such.
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
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The Grand Negus wrote:
each PAL will behave according to the cultural norms that apply
Brilliant. I pull some code from CVS that Bob wrote and my PAL 3000 has no idea how to compile it.
Colin Urquhart wrote:
I pull some code from CVS that Bob wrote and my PAL 3000 has no idea how to compile it.
the perfect compiler, all programs are obfuscated by the owner automatically through use of local colloquial English and completely useless for sharing code and team production... why it sounds like... a Cobol shop!
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
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The Grand Negus wrote:
each PAL will behave according to the cultural norms that apply
Brilliant. I pull some code from CVS that Bob wrote and my PAL 3000 has no idea how to compile it.
Colin Urquhart wrote:
Brilliant. I pull some code from CVS that Bob wrote and my PAL 3000 has no idea how to compile it.
Not quite. A PAL first attempts to understand according to the cultural norms of the environment it reside in, as a human does. Failing that, it adjusts its scope and tries again, as a mature or experienced human does. Failing again, it considers unlikely and unusual interpretations, again, as a (persistent) human does. A fully cosmoPALitan machine will even consider different languages (but starting with the original utterance). The good news is that, unlike some, a typical PAL will refrain from comment on an architecture and a plan that it hasn't studied and therefore can't possibly understand.
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The Grand Negus wrote:
We hope to gain some insights this way.
so far you have not gained any, and we've all offered a lot. Your statement as always is you know the "right" way and everyone else is "wrong." Writing English that way will get you the worst of any English variation spoken to you... and yet you are always shocked that you are treated as such.
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
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Colin Urquhart wrote:
Brilliant. I pull some code from CVS that Bob wrote and my PAL 3000 has no idea how to compile it.
Not quite. A PAL first attempts to understand according to the cultural norms of the environment it reside in, as a human does. Failing that, it adjusts its scope and tries again, as a mature or experienced human does. Failing again, it considers unlikely and unusual interpretations, again, as a (persistent) human does. A fully cosmoPALitan machine will even consider different languages (but starting with the original utterance). The good news is that, unlike some, a typical PAL will refrain from comment on an architecture and a plan that it hasn't studied and therefore can't possibly understand.
As you said before:
The Grand Negus wrote:
The machine understands what it's been taught to understand
But my PAL 3000 has no clue what Bob has been teaching his. His code is therefore useless to me until I've retrained mine. The side effect is that I want my code to punch the lights when I say "Hit the lights". Bob's code has taught my compiler to simply switch it on. Now my code doesn't work the way I want it.
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As you said before:
The Grand Negus wrote:
The machine understands what it's been taught to understand
But my PAL 3000 has no clue what Bob has been teaching his. His code is therefore useless to me until I've retrained mine. The side effect is that I want my code to punch the lights when I say "Hit the lights". Bob's code has taught my compiler to simply switch it on. Now my code doesn't work the way I want it.
Colin Urquhart wrote:
But my PAL 3000 has no clue what Bob has been teaching his.
It does if you let your PAL out on the "alternet"(tm) to play with his friends.
Colin Urquhart wrote:
His code is therefore useless to me until I've retrained mine.
No, your PAL does things the way you like when you're talking to it. When Bob is addressing it, it does things Bob's way. When it doesn't recognize the speaker, it either does nothing (because it doesn't accept that person's authority to boss it around), or it responds in the most generally applicable way - like a human.
Colin Urquhart wrote:
The side effect is that I want my code to punch the lights when I say "Hit the lights". Bob's code has taught my compiler to simply switch it on. Now my code doesn't work the way I want it.
See above. Your PAL will punch the lights in response to you saying "Hit the lights". It will switch them on when Bob says the same thing, or when you say "Hit the lights like you do for Bob." Isn't this what you'd expect a human to do? And an "apparently intelligent"(tm) machine? But once again - this time more bluntly - you're shooting in the dark. Since you haven't even asked about our architecture and our plan, you can't possibly know what you're aiming at.
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Colin Urquhart wrote:
But my PAL 3000 has no clue what Bob has been teaching his.
It does if you let your PAL out on the "alternet"(tm) to play with his friends.
Colin Urquhart wrote:
His code is therefore useless to me until I've retrained mine.
No, your PAL does things the way you like when you're talking to it. When Bob is addressing it, it does things Bob's way. When it doesn't recognize the speaker, it either does nothing (because it doesn't accept that person's authority to boss it around), or it responds in the most generally applicable way - like a human.
Colin Urquhart wrote:
The side effect is that I want my code to punch the lights when I say "Hit the lights". Bob's code has taught my compiler to simply switch it on. Now my code doesn't work the way I want it.
See above. Your PAL will punch the lights in response to you saying "Hit the lights". It will switch them on when Bob says the same thing, or when you say "Hit the lights like you do for Bob." Isn't this what you'd expect a human to do? And an "apparently intelligent"(tm) machine? But once again - this time more bluntly - you're shooting in the dark. Since you haven't even asked about our architecture and our plan, you can't possibly know what you're aiming at.
The Grand Negus wrote:
But once again - this time more bluntly - you're shooting in the dark. Since you haven't even asked about our architecture and our plan, you can't possibly know what you're aiming at.
I was aiming sqarely at your post[^].
The Grand Negus wrote:
"Hit the lights like you do for Bob."
So I'd need to change Bob's code get it to compile for me? My compiler has never met Bob.
The Grand Negus wrote:
Isn't this what you'd expect a human to do?
That's the problem - human's don't understand each other even when they speak the same language. We seem to be having the same problem in this conversation.
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The Grand Negus wrote:
But once again - this time more bluntly - you're shooting in the dark. Since you haven't even asked about our architecture and our plan, you can't possibly know what you're aiming at.
I was aiming sqarely at your post[^].
The Grand Negus wrote:
"Hit the lights like you do for Bob."
So I'd need to change Bob's code get it to compile for me? My compiler has never met Bob.
The Grand Negus wrote:
Isn't this what you'd expect a human to do?
That's the problem - human's don't understand each other even when they speak the same language. We seem to be having the same problem in this conversation.
Colin Urquhart wrote:
So I'd need to change Bob's code get it to compile for me?
No. Your compiled code and Bob's compiled code can reside at the same time in the same machine. The question is which compiled code is executed given a particular command; the decision is made as I outlined in my previous post.
Colin Urquhart wrote:
My compiler has never met Bob.
If your PAL has been playing with another PAL that knows (or knows of) Bob, then your PAL does know (or at least, knows of) Bob.
Colin Urquhart wrote:
That's the problem - human's don't understand each other even when they speak the same language.
I think you mean, "humans don't always understand each other even when they speak the same language" to which I'd add, "but they do understand each other, often enough, to get at least some things accomplished - even when, on occasion, they speak different languages." You're starting to sound like Jeffry. We're not trying to build a machine that never makes mistakes - that is impossible. On the contrary, we're trying to build a machine that understands language like a human (and that will, therefore, make the same kinds of mistakes that humans do, under the same conditions).
Colin Urquhart wrote:
We seem to be having the same problem in this conversation.
Perhaps - one more time - because you've jumped into the middle of something without the necessary prerequisites?
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Colin Urquhart wrote:
So I'd need to change Bob's code get it to compile for me?
No. Your compiled code and Bob's compiled code can reside at the same time in the same machine. The question is which compiled code is executed given a particular command; the decision is made as I outlined in my previous post.
Colin Urquhart wrote:
My compiler has never met Bob.
If your PAL has been playing with another PAL that knows (or knows of) Bob, then your PAL does know (or at least, knows of) Bob.
Colin Urquhart wrote:
That's the problem - human's don't understand each other even when they speak the same language.
I think you mean, "humans don't always understand each other even when they speak the same language" to which I'd add, "but they do understand each other, often enough, to get at least some things accomplished - even when, on occasion, they speak different languages." You're starting to sound like Jeffry. We're not trying to build a machine that never makes mistakes - that is impossible. On the contrary, we're trying to build a machine that understands language like a human (and that will, therefore, make the same kinds of mistakes that humans do, under the same conditions).
Colin Urquhart wrote:
We seem to be having the same problem in this conversation.
Perhaps - one more time - because you've jumped into the middle of something without the necessary prerequisites?
The Grand Negus wrote:
I think you mean
QED.