Do you really think so ? Python is nice and easy, I'd admit, but I found Java harder than C++ when learning both at the same time. I admit I had no trouble with pointers, is that what you were thinking of ? As for C#, and especially VB, why learn to do things badly first off ? Why assume the guy is too stupid to learn C++ without giving him a chance ? Christian After all, there's nothing wrong with an elite as long as I'm allowed to be part of it!! - Mike Burston Oct 23, 2001