Unacceptable?
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Hello! I'm thinking on start to post a lot of messages related to the great paradigm of the new plain CATALAN LANGUAGE COMPILER... It is as strange as yours, but I like CATALAN and I'll use that language to do that... Could you please send me all the source code of your work... Then I'll be able to translate the functions and all this stuff to CATALAN. I'm sure that only me will use that, but then this will place CATALAN at the same level than ENGLISH... (ooops! sorry, I shouldn't have posted that here...) I've seen that negus is a noun used formerly as a title for emperors of Ethiopia... (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/negus[^])... I don't want to be an emperor... I think I can continue being the BIGGEST AND GREATEST SUPER-ULTRA-WONDERFUL-EVER-KING-OF-THE-UNIVERSE-THAT-IS-BIGGER-THAN-ANYTHING-ELSE-EVEN-THE-GRAND-NEGUS-DON'T-MISS-THAT... and as I suppose that nobody here will speak CATALAN, I'll translate it as Joan Murt... (in this way I must not change my name here in CP)... PS: this is for you guys in the CP... be prepared... I'm coming!!!! HAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHHHAHAAHHHHHghg ggc *cough* *cough* :rose:
Do you have a manifesto, or was that just it? :rolleyes:
Simply Elegant Designs JimmyRopes Designs
Think inside the box! ProActive Secure Systems
I'm on-line therefore I am. JimmyRopes -
The Grand Negus wrote:
Does anyone see a problem here?
Yes. You are not the world's cop on what is right and wrong.
The Grand Negus wrote:
Isn't it Microsoft's job to document the operating system and provide programmers with the means to use it?
It is documented. In fact, there's a lot of information on using PInvoke on the Microsoft website that is FAR better than what's on pinvoke.net. Just because someone decides to re-invent the wheel (which frankly is what pinvoke is in many cases) doesn't mean somebody else isn't doing there job.
The Grand Negus wrote:
Clearly, anyone who promotes Microsoft's principles and products should be ashamed.
Why? The implication here is that Microsoft must be perfect and that a community built resource is somehow representative of imperfection. If you want to make the world a better place, I'd start with something more important to the average Joe than whether Microsoft provides an C# pinvoke example for every one of its (documented) SDK API's. If you want to make this forum a better place, I'd suggest taking a hike. Marc
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer
People who say that they will refactor their code later to make it "good" don't understand refactoring, nor the art and craft of programming. -- Josh SmithMarc - I'm getting a slight hint of ambivalence towards pinvoke.net from you here.
the last thing I want to see is some pasty-faced geek with skin so pale that it's almost translucent trying to bump parts with a partner - John Simmons / outlaw programmer
Deja View - the feeling that you've seen this post before. -
See[^]. Does anyone see a problem here? Isn't it Microsoft's job to document the operating system and provide programmers with the means to use it? Is Visual Studio really so deficient that a programmer must resort to a wiki to get a function header? Is C# so incomplete that a programmer can't convert a point from device to logical coordinates without leaping out of the managed code paradigm? Clearly, anyone who promotes Microsoft's principles and products should be ashamed.
Unacceptable? The Grand Negus Is it an odd, yet humorous, coincidence that these two items appear on the same line? Yes, I think so! Ah, but not quite a coincidence, rather a statement of belief for I do find you Unacceptable.
Dave Kreskowiak Microsoft MVP - Visual Basic
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Do you have a manifesto, or was that just it? :rolleyes:
Simply Elegant Designs JimmyRopes Designs
Think inside the box! ProActive Secure Systems
I'm on-line therefore I am. JimmyRopes -
Marc - I'm getting a slight hint of ambivalence towards pinvoke.net from you here.
the last thing I want to see is some pasty-faced geek with skin so pale that it's almost translucent trying to bump parts with a partner - John Simmons / outlaw programmer
Deja View - the feeling that you've seen this post before.Pete O`Hanlon wrote:
Marc - I'm getting a slight hint of ambivalence towards pinvoke.net from you here.
Well, after my experience with asynchronous device read/write functions not properly handling GC issues, yeah, I'm ambivalent. OTOH, I didn't take the time to edit the page and fix it, so I'm still part of the problem, rather than the solution. :) Marc
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer
People who say that they will refactor their code later to make it "good" don't understand refactoring, nor the art and craft of programming. -- Josh Smith -
See[^]. Does anyone see a problem here? Isn't it Microsoft's job to document the operating system and provide programmers with the means to use it? Is Visual Studio really so deficient that a programmer must resort to a wiki to get a function header? Is C# so incomplete that a programmer can't convert a point from device to logical coordinates without leaping out of the managed code paradigm? Clearly, anyone who promotes Microsoft's principles and products should be ashamed.
The Grand Negus wrote:
Isn't it Microsoft's job to document the operating system and provide programmers with the means to use it?
Is that really what Microsoft's job is? There's no argument that they wouldn't have got to where they are had they not opened up APIs for everyone to use but did they have to? I don't think so. Whatever....I'm so ashamed that because of their idiocyncrocies I can make a good living for life. Bummer.
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See[^]. Does anyone see a problem here? Isn't it Microsoft's job to document the operating system and provide programmers with the means to use it? Is Visual Studio really so deficient that a programmer must resort to a wiki to get a function header? Is C# so incomplete that a programmer can't convert a point from device to logical coordinates without leaping out of the managed code paradigm? Clearly, anyone who promotes Microsoft's principles and products should be ashamed.
The Grand Negus wrote:
Unacceptable?
your middle name. ;P
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
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Hello! I'm thinking on start to post a lot of messages related to the great paradigm of the new plain CATALAN LANGUAGE COMPILER... It is as strange as yours, but I like CATALAN and I'll use that language to do that... Could you please send me all the source code of your work... Then I'll be able to translate the functions and all this stuff to CATALAN. I'm sure that only me will use that, but then this will place CATALAN at the same level than ENGLISH... (ooops! sorry, I shouldn't have posted that here...) I've seen that negus is a noun used formerly as a title for emperors of Ethiopia... (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/negus[^])... I don't want to be an emperor... I think I can continue being the BIGGEST AND GREATEST SUPER-ULTRA-WONDERFUL-EVER-KING-OF-THE-UNIVERSE-THAT-IS-BIGGER-THAN-ANYTHING-ELSE-EVEN-THE-GRAND-NEGUS-DON'T-MISS-THAT... and as I suppose that nobody here will speak CATALAN, I'll translate it as Joan Murt... (in this way I must not change my name here in CP)... PS: this is for you guys in the CP... be prepared... I'm coming!!!! HAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHHHAHAAHHHHHghg ggc *cough* *cough* :rose:
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The Grand Negus wrote:
Isn't it Microsoft's job to document the operating system and provide programmers with the means to use it?
Is that really what Microsoft's job is? There's no argument that they wouldn't have got to where they are had they not opened up APIs for everyone to use but did they have to? I don't think so. Whatever....I'm so ashamed that because of their idiocyncrocies I can make a good living for life. Bummer.
Mark Salsbery wrote:
Is that really what Microsoft's job is?
Yes. The vendor of an operating system documents his work so others can write application programs that run on top of it.
Mark Salsbery wrote:
because of their idiocyncrocies I can make a good living for life.
Is making up for the idiosyncrasies of another really a "good living"? And do you really want to do that for your whole life? You sound ripe for a blessing - the Great Osmosian Blessing: "May God give you exactly what you're asking for." Amen.
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Mark Salsbery wrote:
Is that really what Microsoft's job is?
Yes. The vendor of an operating system documents his work so others can write application programs that run on top of it.
Mark Salsbery wrote:
because of their idiocyncrocies I can make a good living for life.
Is making up for the idiosyncrasies of another really a "good living"? And do you really want to do that for your whole life? You sound ripe for a blessing - the Great Osmosian Blessing: "May God give you exactly what you're asking for." Amen.
The Grand Negus wrote:
The vendor of an operating system documents his work so others can write application programs that run on top of it.
I'm not convinced that MS is really in the OS business though. Oh, they create and sell operating systems, no doubt about that... but i never got a good vibe from them, if you know what i mean - it always seemed as though operating systems, frameworks, platforms... were sort of a by-product of whatever it was MS was really up to...
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Mark Salsbery wrote:
Is that really what Microsoft's job is?
Yes. The vendor of an operating system documents his work so others can write application programs that run on top of it.
Mark Salsbery wrote:
because of their idiocyncrocies I can make a good living for life.
Is making up for the idiosyncrasies of another really a "good living"? And do you really want to do that for your whole life? You sound ripe for a blessing - the Great Osmosian Blessing: "May God give you exactly what you're asking for." Amen.
The Grand Negus wrote:
Yes. The vendor of an operating system documents his work so others can write application programs that run on top of it.
In a perfect world. I still don't believe it's a requirement.
The Grand Negus wrote:
Is making up for the idiosyncrasies of another really a "good living"? And do you really want to do that for your whole life?
I'm personally having no trouble with writing for the Windows OS. If I have to occasionally dig for a solution then that's ok. Many people won't even look in the SDK. All I'm saying is if it was easy and perfectly documented then everybody would be doing it and I wouldn't make as much money. That may go against your Osmosian order but frankly, I'm no spiritual coder. I do it for the money. I'd rather not have to work :) Thanks for the blessing :)
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The Grand Negus wrote:
The vendor of an operating system documents his work so others can write application programs that run on top of it.
I'm not convinced that MS is really in the OS business though. Oh, they create and sell operating systems, no doubt about that... but i never got a good vibe from them, if you know what i mean - it always seemed as though operating systems, frameworks, platforms... were sort of a by-product of whatever it was MS was really up to...
I agree. I'm far from being a conspiracy theorist but I've been convinced on one occasion that MS only provided a dumbed-down API. Why wouldn't they though? They are in the software business and being the OS creator as well has distinct advantages :) That's a much more lowdown and dirty tactic then having some lame documentation IMO. Mark
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The Grand Negus wrote:
The vendor of an operating system documents his work so others can write application programs that run on top of it.
I'm not convinced that MS is really in the OS business though. Oh, they create and sell operating systems, no doubt about that... but i never got a good vibe from them, if you know what i mean - it always seemed as though operating systems, frameworks, platforms... were sort of a by-product of whatever it was MS was really up to...
I have a book with interviews of "successful" developers from years back. One of them is Bill Gates and he goes on and on about how proud he was to be able to squeeze the print command for his basic interpreter into 20 bytes of assembler code. You're right; somewhere along the line his priorities changed...
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The Grand Negus wrote:
Yes. The vendor of an operating system documents his work so others can write application programs that run on top of it.
In a perfect world. I still don't believe it's a requirement.
The Grand Negus wrote:
Is making up for the idiosyncrasies of another really a "good living"? And do you really want to do that for your whole life?
I'm personally having no trouble with writing for the Windows OS. If I have to occasionally dig for a solution then that's ok. Many people won't even look in the SDK. All I'm saying is if it was easy and perfectly documented then everybody would be doing it and I wouldn't make as much money. That may go against your Osmosian order but frankly, I'm no spiritual coder. I do it for the money. I'd rather not have to work :) Thanks for the blessing :)
The best thing a man can do for himself (and those around him) is ask himself, "If I didn't need money, what would I do?" And then he should start doing that. If he does, he'll find himself not only more fulfilled, but he'll discover that the money takes care of itself.
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I have a book with interviews of "successful" developers from years back. One of them is Bill Gates and he goes on and on about how proud he was to be able to squeeze the print command for his basic interpreter into 20 bytes of assembler code. You're right; somewhere along the line his priorities changed...
The Grand Negus wrote:
he goes on and on about how proud he was to be able to squeeze the print command for his basic interpreter into 20 bytes of assembler code.
Yeah... I get a huge kick out of reading the various blogs written by Microsoft developers. There are some seriously talented people there, very dedicated to what they're doing, determined to do it well... ...Of course, there are huge parts of Windows that don't get blogged about. Bits that no one could ever be enthusiastic about, the bits written by people who just don't have it in 'em. And the people who might have once been enthusiastic about what they're doing, but have had it beaten out of them by too much process and too little freedom. The two "coolest" things i've seen in Vista so far? A searchable Start menu, and an enhanced MessageBox(). Honestly, that's just sad.
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The Grand Negus wrote:
he goes on and on about how proud he was to be able to squeeze the print command for his basic interpreter into 20 bytes of assembler code.
Yeah... I get a huge kick out of reading the various blogs written by Microsoft developers. There are some seriously talented people there, very dedicated to what they're doing, determined to do it well... ...Of course, there are huge parts of Windows that don't get blogged about. Bits that no one could ever be enthusiastic about, the bits written by people who just don't have it in 'em. And the people who might have once been enthusiastic about what they're doing, but have had it beaten out of them by too much process and too little freedom. The two "coolest" things i've seen in Vista so far? A searchable Start menu, and an enhanced MessageBox(). Honestly, that's just sad.
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The Grand Negus wrote:
See[^].
Blast! I wish you had at least written "See Nish's thread" instead of objectifying me and my thread into a mere incident you could capitalize on to push your stuff. I bet that if your English language compiler works at all, that it lacks politeness and etiquette and is an extremely rude compiler. :rolleyes:
Regards, Nish
Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
Currently working on C++/CLI in Action for Manning Publications. (*Sample chapter available online*)Nishant Sivakumar wrote:
I bet that if your English language compiler works at all
From first hand experience I can say that it does indeed work and I believe the way it works is very impressive however it lacks most of the user interface that we expect from a professional software product made in this decade. I believe in its current form it is best suited for use in a computer programming class to show students yet another way of programming.
John
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See[^]. Does anyone see a problem here? Isn't it Microsoft's job to document the operating system and provide programmers with the means to use it? Is Visual Studio really so deficient that a programmer must resort to a wiki to get a function header? Is C# so incomplete that a programmer can't convert a point from device to logical coordinates without leaping out of the managed code paradigm? Clearly, anyone who promotes Microsoft's principles and products should be ashamed.
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Nishant Sivakumar wrote:
I bet that if your English language compiler works at all
From first hand experience I can say that it does indeed work and I believe the way it works is very impressive however it lacks most of the user interface that we expect from a professional software product made in this decade. I believe in its current form it is best suited for use in a computer programming class to show students yet another way of programming.
John
That's good to know, John.
Regards, Nish
Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
Currently working on C++/CLI in Action for Manning Publications. (*Sample chapter available online*) -
Nishant Sivakumar wrote:
I bet that if your English language compiler works at all
From first hand experience I can say that it does indeed work and I believe the way it works is very impressive however it lacks most of the user interface that we expect from a professional software product made in this decade. I believe in its current form it is best suited for use in a computer programming class to show students yet another way of programming.
John
John M. Drescher wrote:
From first hand experience I can say that it does indeed work and I believe the way it works is very impressive however it lacks most of the user interface that we expect from a professional software product made in this decade.
Thanks for the compliment. The user interface is the way it is for three reasons: (1) It is designed to challenge preconceived notions. Specifically, how many of the widgets, gadgets, and redundant ways of doing things commonly found in a "software product made in this decade" are really necessary? For example, the Adobe PDF reader I use has over 110 different commands for adjusting page magnification; our page editor has just two. Our interface is offered as a minimalist (yet useful) corrective to such excesses. (2) Our interface is independent of the operating system. It looks the same under Windows 95, XP, and Vista. When we port it to LINUX, it will look the same there. Exactly the same. Nothing new to learn; nothing new to "get used to". Nothing new to document; nothing new to teach. A great productivity aid. (3) We like it the way it is. Really. And having used it to write several very significant programs, and having used the built-in page editor for designing everything from house plans to children's books, we think it's fair to say that it works and works well - at least for us.