Incredible
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Mustafa Ismail Mustafa wrote:
For him to refuse to have our own group that would be working on this ON OUR OWN TIME seems SO narrow minded and short sided to me.
That's crazy ! You do wathever it pleases you during your spare time. And it is even a bonus for him because you could be usefull in other situations. I don't understand his point :confused:. Maybe he understood that you wanted to do that during working hours ?
Cédric Moonen Software developer
Charting control [v1.2]no no, I specifically told him that it'll be during our spare time. I tried to make him understand that we want him to be aware of what we're doing and planning on doing. He's just dead set against it.
Cedric Moonen wrote:
That's crazy !
No one can dispute facts!
Cedric Moonen wrote:
You do wathever it pleases you during your spare time.
Damn right! And that's what I'm planning on doing.
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook "There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance." Ali ibn Abi Talib "Animadvertistine, ubicumque stes, fumum recta in faciem ferri?"
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General custom made software. Your typical three layered app(s). The purpose of the group was not to intrude on our working schedules, but rather for me and the other 2 guys (and whoever else thats interested) to try and maintain a sharp edge when it comes to C++ (specifically) development. And I had mentioned C# to him about 14 months ago when I first joined the company then. The answer was to similar lines but the context was different because I was talking about project development using C#, not something during my own time.
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook "There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance." Ali ibn Abi Talib "Animadvertistine, ubicumque stes, fumum recta in faciem ferri?"
If I were your boss, and you asked me for company support to use a language that we didn't use, and had no intention of using, would scream "I'm not happy here and want out, but need to brush my skills up on your time first"....perhaps that's his beef?
"Knock me down, I'll get straight back up again, I'll come back stronger than a powered up pacman" (Lilly Allen / Kaiser Chiefs)
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S Smerk wrote:
People hate what they don't understand.
Is that why everyone here hates VB? :)
I actually hate it because its been teaching me bad habits!
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook "There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance." Ali ibn Abi Talib "Animadvertistine, ubicumque stes, fumum recta in faciem ferri?"
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Why did you asked for his permission then? Were you planning doing this at the office or elsewhere? In any case, if it is after work, where is the need to tell your boss?
It wasn't really permission. It was more of a "we're keeping you in the loop" thing. Don't get me wrong, he's a really nice guy, but obviously he can be quite THICK. But that's my own biased opinion that is a result of disgust, astonishment and a prevalent sense of WTF?
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook "There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance." Ali ibn Abi Talib "Animadvertistine, ubicumque stes, fumum recta in faciem ferri?"
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If I were your boss, and you asked me for company support to use a language that we didn't use, and had no intention of using, would scream "I'm not happy here and want out, but need to brush my skills up on your time first"....perhaps that's his beef?
"Knock me down, I'll get straight back up again, I'll come back stronger than a powered up pacman" (Lilly Allen / Kaiser Chiefs)
But it wasn't on his time :( Heck, if the group formed we would have met every other Thursday work schedules permitting. :confused:
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook "There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance." Ali ibn Abi Talib "Animadvertistine, ubicumque stes, fumum recta in faciem ferri?"
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Thanks Marc. You can't guess how passionate I've become about this. For him to refuse to have our own group that would be working on this ON OUR OWN TIME seems SO narrow minded and short sided to me. Several times (before either one of the three I mentioned) joined the company, they had to freelance/outsource some C++ library development. Since it appears that the likelihood of this happening again is high enough, I would have expected he would have tried to set something up himself. I'm so p!ssed at the moment. Eft!
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook "There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance." Ali ibn Abi Talib "Animadvertistine, ubicumque stes, fumum recta in faciem ferri?"
I can tell you from experience that you're fighting a losing battle. He's tasted the turd that is VB.Net, and he's grown to like the flavor.
"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass..." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997
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"...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001 -
It wasn't really permission. It was more of a "we're keeping you in the loop" thing. Don't get me wrong, he's a really nice guy, but obviously he can be quite THICK. But that's my own biased opinion that is a result of disgust, astonishment and a prevalent sense of WTF?
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook "There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance." Ali ibn Abi Talib "Animadvertistine, ubicumque stes, fumum recta in faciem ferri?"
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I can tell you from experience that you're fighting a losing battle. He's tasted the turd that is VB.Net, and he's grown to like the flavor.
"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass..." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997
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"...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001:laugh::laugh::laugh:
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I code using VB.net for a living and honestly, I' try my absolute best to try and stay fit using other languages that are more C-Based. This is for my own benefit frankly as there isn't much reception for it here in the company, in fact, there are only two other guys here that have an interest almost equaling mine. With this in mind, I was talking to these guys about setting up some sort of group that tries to maintain C++ fitness. I actually went to talk to the CTO about it and he completely gunned it down. Not only did he refuse it out of hand, he proclaimed and I quote "No one here likes C++, in fact, there is no use for C++ anymore." :wtf::omg::mad: I can't believe it. Obviously I'll be carrying on with my own plans, but without the support and blessing of the Company. :suss:
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook "There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance." Ali ibn Abi Talib "Animadvertistine, ubicumque stes, fumum recta in faciem ferri?"
Mustafa Ismail Mustafa wrote:
With this in mind, I was talking to these guys about setting up some sort of group that tries to maintain C++ fitness. I actually went to talk to the CTO about it and he completely gunned it down. Not only did he refuse it out of hand, he proclaimed and I quote "No one here likes C++, in fact, there is no use for C++ anymore."
You could look for user groups in your local area.
Upcoming FREE developer events: * Glasgow: SQL Server Managed Objects AND Reporting Services ... My website
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I can tell you from experience that you're fighting a losing battle. He's tasted the turd that is VB.Net, and he's grown to like the flavor.
"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass..." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997
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"...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001:laugh: That's a 5 :-D I believe what you're saying is right. I'll be taking Colin's advice to heart and to look for local groups here and if not see about setting one up with other developers who feel as strongly about this as I do.
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook "There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance." Ali ibn Abi Talib "Animadvertistine, ubicumque stes, fumum recta in faciem ferri?"
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Mustafa Ismail Mustafa wrote:
With this in mind, I was talking to these guys about setting up some sort of group that tries to maintain C++ fitness. I actually went to talk to the CTO about it and he completely gunned it down. Not only did he refuse it out of hand, he proclaimed and I quote "No one here likes C++, in fact, there is no use for C++ anymore."
You could look for user groups in your local area.
Upcoming FREE developer events: * Glasgow: SQL Server Managed Objects AND Reporting Services ... My website
I'll definitely do that; And if I can't find any I'll look into setting one up.
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook "There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance." Ali ibn Abi Talib "Animadvertistine, ubicumque stes, fumum recta in faciem ferri?"
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Well maybe no use for them. There is still a lot of applications written in C/C++ and will continue for quite some time. Most Operating Systems of today are still written in ASM/C/C++ as well as many device drivers. That said though, in typical data driven business applications today, C++ is really a legacy technology and few use it. Just take a look at the job market and you will find that C++ demand is flat out dying. I used C/C++ pretty much all the time for close to two decades, but once C#/.NET came out, I had no need for C++ again. Language wars will continue forever, but what really matters is that you get involved in a marketable language (one that has plenty of jobs) and master it. Not so important which one as long as it one of the popular ones. Learning or staying up with C++ is really of little value.
Rocky <>< Blog Post: ASP.NET MVC Part 1 Tech Blog Post: Cheap Biofuels and Synthetics coming soon?
Rocky Moore wrote:
Just take a look at the job market and you will find that C++ demand is flat out dying.
I just did and saw that C++ demand is stronger than ever.
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Well maybe no use for them. There is still a lot of applications written in C/C++ and will continue for quite some time. Most Operating Systems of today are still written in ASM/C/C++ as well as many device drivers. That said though, in typical data driven business applications today, C++ is really a legacy technology and few use it. Just take a look at the job market and you will find that C++ demand is flat out dying. I used C/C++ pretty much all the time for close to two decades, but once C#/.NET came out, I had no need for C++ again. Language wars will continue forever, but what really matters is that you get involved in a marketable language (one that has plenty of jobs) and master it. Not so important which one as long as it one of the popular ones. Learning or staying up with C++ is really of little value.
Rocky <>< Blog Post: ASP.NET MVC Part 1 Tech Blog Post: Cheap Biofuels and Synthetics coming soon?
Rocky Moore wrote:
Learning or staying up with C++ is really of little value.
Right, unless your a major software vendor, like Microsoft, Oracle, Adobe, Alias|Wavefront, Lightwave, ToonBoom, Autodesk, NewTek, Borland, Google, Apple, and countless other CAD, graphics, Word processor/office suite, developer tools, and thousands of other software products out there. None of them are being written in .Net. And lets not eve start with the embedded market. My understanding is that most of these devices use C++ for the whole application stack, from the OS to the end-user layer*. Not all software is a "typical data driven business application". I don't know why people keep trying to paint this picture, or give the impression that it is. *Sadly some of these C++ frameworks that they use are sucky, but from what I've seen they aren't very good because they were poorly designed, not due to any language constraints.
¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire! Real Mentats use only 100% pure, unfooled around with Sapho Juice(tm)! SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0 0 rows returned Save an Orange - Use the VCF! VCF Blog
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I code using VB.net for a living and honestly, I' try my absolute best to try and stay fit using other languages that are more C-Based. This is for my own benefit frankly as there isn't much reception for it here in the company, in fact, there are only two other guys here that have an interest almost equaling mine. With this in mind, I was talking to these guys about setting up some sort of group that tries to maintain C++ fitness. I actually went to talk to the CTO about it and he completely gunned it down. Not only did he refuse it out of hand, he proclaimed and I quote "No one here likes C++, in fact, there is no use for C++ anymore." :wtf::omg::mad: I can't believe it. Obviously I'll be carrying on with my own plans, but without the support and blessing of the Company. :suss:
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook "There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance." Ali ibn Abi Talib "Animadvertistine, ubicumque stes, fumum recta in faciem ferri?"
Do you ask your company if you can watch TV on the weekend? Why would you ask your company what you can do on your spare time? If you didn't want to do it on their clock or space, why did you bother asking?
Mike Lasseter
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It wasn't really permission. It was more of a "we're keeping you in the loop" thing. Don't get me wrong, he's a really nice guy, but obviously he can be quite THICK. But that's my own biased opinion that is a result of disgust, astonishment and a prevalent sense of WTF?
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook "There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance." Ali ibn Abi Talib "Animadvertistine, ubicumque stes, fumum recta in faciem ferri?"
Ah. Ok. Sounds like a man who should be well outside the loop then... (Or possibly inside it, with it contracting around him)
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Rocky Moore wrote:
Just take a look at the job market and you will find that C++ demand is flat out dying.
Really? I wouldn't say dying, in decline maybe, but not dying. I am looking for jobs in Canada and the US (home for me is Edmonton, Alberta) and though the demand for them is less than before its not exactly dead (or dying) IMO. As is, I'm staying here in the Middle East until I finish my Masters Degree and then I'll be heading back to Canada or so my plans are at the moment.
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook "There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance." Ali ibn Abi Talib "Animadvertistine, ubicumque stes, fumum recta in faciem ferri?"
Last time I was looking around Edmonton for jobs there was only one place that used VB a lot and they were working on phasing it out as soon as possible. If you were still in Edmonton I wouldn't mind setting up a group to try and further C++ skills also, I mainly work in C++ but finding interesting stuff out is always fun.
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S Smerk wrote:
People hate what they don't understand.
Is that why everyone here hates VB? :)
probably. however, I started in vb, then went to java and c++, and now c#. I love C#.
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I code using VB.net for a living and honestly, I' try my absolute best to try and stay fit using other languages that are more C-Based. This is for my own benefit frankly as there isn't much reception for it here in the company, in fact, there are only two other guys here that have an interest almost equaling mine. With this in mind, I was talking to these guys about setting up some sort of group that tries to maintain C++ fitness. I actually went to talk to the CTO about it and he completely gunned it down. Not only did he refuse it out of hand, he proclaimed and I quote "No one here likes C++, in fact, there is no use for C++ anymore." :wtf::omg::mad: I can't believe it. Obviously I'll be carrying on with my own plans, but without the support and blessing of the Company. :suss:
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook "There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance." Ali ibn Abi Talib "Animadvertistine, ubicumque stes, fumum recta in faciem ferri?"
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S Smerk wrote:
People hate what they don't understand.
Is that why everyone here hates VB? :)
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No. Sad to say, i actually understand idiocy. I just don't enjoy it. :rolleyes:
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...the wind blows over it and it is gone, and its place remembers it no more...
Young man to Dorothy Parker: I can't bear fools! Dorothy Parker: How odd - your mother obviously could! :)
