EQOTD - English Question of the Day - verbalized transition
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Mark Wallace wrote: " BillWoodruff wrote: ... ... "What the heck is the present tense of the verb-form of transition?" " Mark, you mis-quote : I did not say those words : the OP said those words. I fail to understand the purpose of the long "fantasia" following the mis-quote that you posted : but are you sure you got everything fully purged there ? :) Perhaps I did not mention to the OP that "transition" is a noun, and not a verb, for a reason, like feeling he didn't really want an "English lesson," just a quick example of proper usage. "change to" ... in the context of "computer programming" and "state" ... is clear, direct, unequivocal, and perfectly acceptable in the context of technical documentation. "Transition" would be appropriate in some technical contexts, for example : "when the user makes the transition from modeless interaction with the user interface to a "modal" form of use, like when using the 'Print Preview' dialog ..." To me "transition to" is awkward, very much second best, barely acceptable, and forms like "transitioning" (a warped gerundive if I've ever seen one) would be absolutely unacceptable. The root form of the word, "transit," when "forced" to be a verb, has a meaning which is inappropriate for programming, but once, long ago, was appropriate in astronomy, as in "when Venus transits the sun." But, I could be dead wrong, I've only been doing paid technical proof-reading and editing since 1963. There's always something new to learn, and technical lexicons evolve also, spawning neologisms, as well as "fossilizing" archaic remnants like "printf" or "let," and sometimes "demonizing" terms, like "goto." Gods forbid any new technology, like WPF, not arrive wrapped in its own special blanket of language usage, and a whole set of arbitrary "buzzwords" :) best, Bill
"Many : not conversant with mathematical studies, imagine that because it [the Analytical Engine] is to give results in numerical notation, its processes must consequently be arithmetical, numerical, rather than algebraical and analytical. This is an error. The engine can arrange and combine numerical quantities as if they were letters or any other general symbols; and it fact it might bring out its results in algebraical notation, were provisions made accordingly." Ada, Countess Lovelace, 1844
modified on Thursday, December 31, 2009 2:15 AM
Like you, and for the same reasons, I would shy away from using it as a verb, but my preference does not stop it being a verb (an intransitive one, ironically), so, unless its usage made a sentence ugly or unwieldy, I'd leave it in (but then I'd be changing it for reasons of verbosity, rather than for it being or not being a verb). Awkward or bad sentence construction by individuals does not change the rules of syntax.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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So, I'm writing some documentation that's sprinkled of the text "state transition". To get a natural text flow I need say that the Foos and Bars [make verb of transition] to a new state. What the heck is the present tense of the verb-form of transition? Neither *.reference.com nor Google Translate is helpful enough on this. :sigh:
-- Time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time - Bertrand Russel
"Foos and Bars transform to a new state" ? When they have transformed, they have made a transition from one state to another. Just a suggestion!
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Well, its a transitive verb innit? Actually, I'd have thought the word 'change' would be the best most appropriate verb in your example.
Regards, Rob Philpott.
Hear hear! Rich
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So, I'm writing some documentation that's sprinkled of the text "state transition". To get a natural text flow I need say that the Foos and Bars [make verb of transition] to a new state. What the heck is the present tense of the verb-form of transition? Neither *.reference.com nor Google Translate is helpful enough on this. :sigh:
-- Time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time - Bertrand Russel
I'm the last person to ask about this sort of stuff and I'm probably missing something here but surly the answer is transform? e.g. "...the Foos and Bars transform to a new state."
modified on Thursday, December 31, 2009 8:46 AM
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Richard MacCutchan wrote:
Transition is noun or adjective in usage, from the verb to transit (see Chambers Dictionary - the best). You could say that a transition occurs from Foos to Bars, or that the Foos undergo a state transition to Bars.
Cute, but (as you'd expect from Chambers) wrong. Transition is also an intransitive verb.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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I'm the last person to ask about this sort of stuff and I'm probably missing something here but surly the answer is transform? e.g. "...the Foos and Bars transform to a new state."
modified on Thursday, December 31, 2009 8:46 AM
Hi Scott, The word "transform" implies a change in structure : "A slime mold transforms into a fruiting body in response to subtle environmental cues." You could say : "Class Foo is transformed by sub-classing and over-riding the Bar method." Or : "We use inheritance to transform Class Foo into Class SonOfFoo." But, imho, that's language-overkill : all we really need to say is "SonOfFoo" inherits from 'Foo, and over-rides method 'Bar." To "change state" also often implies a structural change also : "H20 changes state from water to ice generally around 0 degrees C." But it would be perfectly acceptable, in modern technical writing, in some circumstances, say after you had listed a specific set of "named states" to write something like : "When the user presses <alt><control><b> the application changes to State X1; please examine the possible outcomes in State X1 in the above diagram." And common usage in programming technical books is to speak of "entering' and "leaving" "state," or being "in a state" : As in : "Before entering the 'foreach loop, we test to make sure the 'Foo collection is not in a null state." "If the site user has filled in all the required fields on the Form, and pressed, 'Submit, the site will enter the state of validating Form fields; however, if validation fails, the site will leave this state, and re-enter the state of displaying the form to the site user again." Note that with the last examples, we get where the distinction between "state" and "mode" is arguable. At one time "state machines," as a formalism for describing computer programs, were just the "bees' knees," but that was long ago. A "problem" with the use of the word "state" is that it has all these other "overtones" related to "status" and "static," and often refers to the current constellation of values of objects, or current settings of user interface widgets, etc. : as in : "Now we'll demonstrate the use of Serialization to maintain UI state in order to implement the 'Undo feature." best, Bill
"Many : not conversant with mathematical studies, imagine that because it [the Analytical Engine] is to give results in numerical notation, its processes must consequently be arithmetical, numerical, rather than algebraical and analytical. This is an error. The engine can arrange and combine numerical quantities as if they were letters or any other general symbols; and it fact it might bring out its results in algebraical notation, were provisions made accor
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Well, its a transitive verb innit? Actually, I'd have thought the word 'change' would be the best most appropriate verb in your example.
Regards, Rob Philpott.
best most, lol that's the best most engrish ever mostest ever. :)
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The present tense verb form of 'transition' is 'transition'. The Foos and Bars transition to a new state. The Foo may transition to the therblig state when the Bar transitions to the fellbarg state, but not while the Framitz is transitioning to either state.
Software Zen:
delete this;
Fold With Us![^] -
Mark Wallace wrote:
Cute, but (as you'd expect from Chambers) wrong.
Not at all, Chambers is well known as a definitive reference second only to the OED.
Mark Wallace wrote:
Transition is also an intransitive verb.
Not in English it isn't.
Richard MacCutchan wrote:
Chambers is well known as a definitive reference second only to the OED WiKipedia
Fixed that for you.
Richard MacCutchan wrote:
Mark Wallace wrote: Transition is also an intransitive verb. Not in English it isn't.
If you read check a real dictionary (OED, American Heritage, etc.), you'll find that it is. On-line references rarely cut the mustard; a dictionary is just too damned much work to create and keep up to date.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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Richard MacCutchan wrote:
Chambers is well known as a definitive reference second only to the OED WiKipedia
Fixed that for you.
Richard MacCutchan wrote:
Mark Wallace wrote: Transition is also an intransitive verb. Not in English it isn't.
If you read check a real dictionary (OED, American Heritage, etc.), you'll find that it is. On-line references rarely cut the mustard; a dictionary is just too damned much work to create and keep up to date.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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That is correct, but transition is intransitive. So though the Foo may transition, we have no business transitioning the Foo.
'Transitioning the Foo' is only valid when you are using BizSpeak™[^].
Software Zen:
delete this;
Fold With Us![^] -
Too readable. ;)
-- Time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time - Bertrand Russel
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Make up a new word - "vestized". It's derived from the word "transvestite"...
.45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly
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"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass..." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997
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"The staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - J. Jystad, 2001Perfect! I followed your advice almost to the point, but I thought transvestite sounded better, so I used it instead. Checked the doc in. Emailed it to the boss and the customers. Waiting for praise. What does that word mean, anyway? ;)
-- Time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time - Bertrand Russel
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Johann Gerell wrote: So, I'm writing some documentation that's sprinkled of the text "state transition". To get a natural text flow I need say that the Foos and Bars [make verb of transition] to a new state. What the heck is the present tense of the verb-form of transition? Neither *.reference.com nor Google Translate is helpful enough on this. Hi Johann, Suggestions : 1. "the Foos and Bars then change state to ... : " : "transition to" would also be acceptable English, but I think the first example is simpler and clearer. 2. for "some documentation that's sprinkled of the text 'state transition'." try : "documentation that frequently uses the phrase "state transition" best, Bill
"Many : not conversant with mathematical studies, imagine that because it [the Analytical Engine] is to give results in numerical notation, its processes must consequently be arithmetical, numerical, rather than algebraical and analytical. This is an error. The engine can arrange and combine numerical quantities as if they were letters or any other general symbols; and it fact it might bring out its results in algebraical notation, were provisions made accordingly." Ada, Countess Lovelace, 1844
BillWoodruff wrote:
try : "documentation that frequently uses the phrase "state transition"
Ahhh! That tastes much better! :)
-- Time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time - Bertrand Russel
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So, I'm writing some documentation that's sprinkled of the text "state transition". To get a natural text flow I need say that the Foos and Bars [make verb of transition] to a new state. What the heck is the present tense of the verb-form of transition? Neither *.reference.com nor Google Translate is helpful enough on this. :sigh:
-- Time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time - Bertrand Russel
change
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So, I'm writing some documentation that's sprinkled of the text "state transition". To get a natural text flow I need say that the Foos and Bars [make verb of transition] to a new state. What the heck is the present tense of the verb-form of transition? Neither *.reference.com nor Google Translate is helpful enough on this. :sigh:
-- Time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time - Bertrand Russel
-
So, I'm writing some documentation that's sprinkled of the text "state transition". To get a natural text flow I need say that the Foos and Bars [make verb of transition] to a new state. What the heck is the present tense of the verb-form of transition? Neither *.reference.com nor Google Translate is helpful enough on this. :sigh:
-- Time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time - Bertrand Russel
It's 'Transition' - in English, you can always verb a noun.
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Steve Westbrook wrote:
Transit. Anyone who says otherwise is a traitor.
I'm a tractor, then. (And tractors can't type)
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
I thought about this for a long time before posting: What?
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change
I agree that change is the right verb for describing a state, err, change. For example: The Foo changes to the Bar state.
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So, I'm writing some documentation that's sprinkled of the text "state transition". To get a natural text flow I need say that the Foos and Bars [make verb of transition] to a new state. What the heck is the present tense of the verb-form of transition? Neither *.reference.com nor Google Translate is helpful enough on this. :sigh:
-- Time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time - Bertrand Russel