I'm still angry with Microsoft.

[Dave Calkins]

Which is why when you hear about that new fad technology being the "new way of doing things from now on" you just keep in mind that it only applies until that too is dropped and forgotten for the next new fad :) Take it for what its worth and use it while its there I guess. Silverlight always did seem like a really solid approach, I think your frustration is valid, but apparently there was some sort of conflict internally wrt Silverlight vs. HTML so the dropping of Silverlight might be more political fallout than anything else (at least thats what I read somewhere... it MUST be true!). It sure can give you a new appreciation for writing good old C++/MFC code which continues to be supported and updated. Whats odd about the WinRT/HTML thing is that the whole metro layer seems to be a limited focus thing not a new way to create all applications. i.e., sure if you want to make a touch app with very minimal UI and put it on the app store it might be a great solution. But in general for applications requiring more detailed user interaction, its just not something that makes sense to switch to. I've been running Win8 for awhile now on the laptop and I don't think I ever use the start screen or any metro apps. Not that they're not nice, just that its not going to be a replacement more like something which augments normal applications. For example, just try using the WinRT metro PDF reader app. Once you do that once, you'll immediately install and run the regular desktop reader application at least I did :)

[Nicholas Marty]

AddIn Project does not show up in the add reference dialog... :^)

[Obliterator]

Agree entirely. Microsoft's sudden about-turns have really damaged my trust in them. We used the WPF platform and I really liked it. Sure it had problems, but it had a number of positives. Now, if I start writing a new desktop app tomorrow, for the first time ever I have no idea what language and framework I should use for the longest possible 'active' development support life-cycle. Crazy.

-- The Obliterator

[Obliterator]

Its already de-supported. The Expression Blend tooling required to work with WPF/Silverligh has been droped. All open support tickets seem to have been closed as 'don't care'. And yes I know Blend has been integrated into VS, but its not feature complete and its not robust. So moving forward you have no real support and no real migration path. The tooling in VS will gradually get worse and worse (just like it did when they 'continued to support' C++/MFC).

-- The Obliterator

[Gary Wheeler]

Because Windows Installer is an abomination before God, and the real reason the Pope retired today.

Software Zen: delete this;

[Clark Kent123]

I completely agree. I am also upset with that decision. I liked their installation product. It interfaced well with VS and it worked.

[Brisingr Aerowing]

There should be a 'Project' tab at the top of that dialog. Both projects have to be in the same solution for the 'Add Project Reference' function to, well, function.

Bob Dole

The internet is a great way to get on the net.

:doh: 2.0.82.7292 SP6a

[BillWoodruff]

Hi OriginalGriff, I can't name the album, but I wonder if the song might have been "I hate myself for loving you," by, who was that singer: one of the Jetsons Family; Joan ... Joanie ? By the way, I just checked on NameCheap.com, and originalgriff.com, and aboriginalgriff.com are both available domains. yours, Bill

"We are all agreed that your theory is crazy. The question which divides us is whether it is crazy enough to have a chance of being correct. My own feeling is that it is not crazy enough."

---

Niels Bohr's comment to Wolfgang Pauli, after Pauli presented Heisenberg's and Pauli's nonlinear field theory of elementary particles, at Columbia University, 1958.

[Ravi Bhavnani]

MehGerbil wrote:

Vision is often recognizing that you've the winning hand right NOW and simply going with it. Retards.

With all due respect, if you think Silverlight is (still) a multi-platform winning-hand UI technology, you're gravely mistaken. :) /ravi PS:  I'm not suggesting HTML/JavaScript is.

My new year resolution: 2048 x 1536 Home | Articles | My .NET bits | Freeware ravib(at)ravib(dot)com

[dazfuller]

Given the pain that Silverlight is causing us I'm glad it's going, that way I don't have to talk people out of using it. But yeah, there's other shit MS is doing that is pissing me off. Forcing standards which only they use for one. They don't have any clear direction on authentication and authorization between their tool sets (OAuth, Claims etc...), the disappearance of the installation project template. Then there's the love which C# is getting from the company as well at the moment. Frankly this just leaves me in a place where I prefer using products which have not originated from MS

Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines

[Nicholas Marty]

Yeah... it should be there... but... the project doesn't show up there ... I suppose that's because the AddIn Project is declared as Class Library Project and hasn't an executable.

[Jaggernaut]

Couldn't agree more. The issue I have with this decision from Microsoft isn't that Silverlight was the best thing that've happened since sliced bread, but rather that I find it disturbing that there are no good alternatives (as of today). Sure you can go with HTML5 and heaps of Javascript and AJAX calls. But WTF, not only would that take MUCH longer to get the way I want it, it would also force our employees to use a specific Web browser, just to have things work the way we intend them to since HTML5 support is varying, to say the least. Our main application is based on a Windows client that they normally run, but with a "light version" using Silverlight for when they're our of office or otherwise unable to use the normal client. For this purpose I still haven't found a nice and yet somewhat easy and efficient way to do this, except for... Silverlight. Flash won't cut it. Java applets (yeah right) and ActiveX components are just dead and buried. So, what to do? Thank you MS.. For yet another kick in the nuts, I'll be the first to leave for LAMP or similar when it's mature enough to completely wipe our present MS based platforms from the face of the earth.

Wexelblats algorithm: Pick two: 1. Good, 2. Fast, 3. Cheap

[OriginalGriff]

I think it was Joan Jett[^] who sang "I hate myself for loving you" (and the "American Chopper" theme tune "Bad reputation"), but no, it was Sharon Den Adel using her wonderful voice on "Why not me". And she was singing "Fire and Ice" when I clicked the link.

If you get an email telling you that you can catch Swine Flu from tinned pork then just delete it. It's Spam.

[JimBob SquarePants]

Wow! Do you even code for the web? Any web application is accessible from a connected device, even on a Mac (Mind blown!) I could boilerplate something that replicated your grids functionality in a matter of hours and be assured that it would not only work both cross-browser but cross-device from mobile to tablet to desktop. "[A] dozen different languages and technologies"... Um no... Three. Three languages; HTML, CSS, and JavaScript. None of which are that difficult and there are plenty of wonderful things like jQuery and Normalise.css to help you smooth out any compatibility issues. If this is too much for you then I suggest you find yourself an alternative career. I hate to break it to you but Silverlight is not the language of the web. It never was and never will be. If it was you might have an argument but it's not. The three aforementioned languages are and they are never going away. Oh and vision, How about the new pointer events specification? https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/pointerevents/raw-file/tip/pointerEvents.html[^] that do? I suggest you pick up your toys, put on your grown up trousers and accept that you are going to have to join the rest of the world. Or you can keep stacking cans in your bunker, up to you.

JimBob SquarePants ******************************************************************* "He took everything personally, including our royalties!" David St.Hubbins, Spinal Tap about Ian Faith, their ex-manager *******************************************************************

[Lost User]

To be honest, my post was intended for the other mortals in the room. People who can write a full business application using only HTML, CSS, and JavaScript are like gods to me.

[JMBeyer]

We publish all our desktop apps using ClickOnce, which is built into Visual Studio. It is so much easier than the installer. Easier for the developer to set up and publish new versions of the app. Easier for the user because we configure it so that apps always check for updates when the app starts and automatically applies the update if one is available. We use this for desktop apps distributed to people who work at our office and for an app we developed that is run by external people across the country.

[User 9154536]

From what I understand MS is abandoning Silverlight because they no longer need to compete with Adobe Flash as an addon for the majority of hand held devices that are currently in use because they don't allow addons. However the MS developer community and many large companies have embraced Silverlight as the UI of choice. Silverlight is widely used and is a fantastic product. I think MS is making a knee-jerk reaction and needs to realize that there is no reason to give up on Silverlight.

[ClockMeister]

MehGerbil wrote:

PRO TIP FOR MICROSOFT: Vision isn't following other's lead. Vision is often recognizing that you've the winning hand right NOW and simply going with it. Retards.

Interesting that you should put it that way. I couldn't have said it better. Fairly recently (after playing with Microsoft's latest "stuff") I realized that it simply isn't a direction that I want to go. I'm hunkering down with my system and tools that I've paid for exactly as they are and plan to stick with them for the long haul. I develop to the desktop and the web. Unless something major changes (I mean a complete platform re-design of the web or something) these tools will last for a long, long time. I'm done chasing the upgrade curve. It's going to be a LONG time before a Winforms or Web application won't run on just about any machine I care to deliver it to. Since making that decision I have been highly productive and creative again instead of wasting time evaluating, installing and uninstalling all these new tools. I'm not against "progress" but some days I view the changes taking place not as progress but mainly a re-design of everything so they can just sell more of 'em. -CB

[StandsWithADodecahedron]

I worked as an install developer for over four years for a large shop--yes,I actually spent 8+ hrs/day doing nothing but install dev. Because I now work for a small company w/many small projects, I made heavy use of the VS Setup template because it was quick and easy. When I ran into the sun-setting of Setup templates, I did a systematic search for a 3rd-party installer. While I did find several products that would have worked, the best value for me was Advanced Installer by Caphyon. The Pro version is just $299, it's easy to use, it works, and the vendor publishes frequent updates with fixes and enhancements. They also have bigger dollar versions in case I ever need it, and a free version. I was able to do things like consolidate 32- and 64-bit installs into a single installer, easily install two windows services (I wrote in VB.NET) in a single installer, specify pre- and post-build actions just like in VS build, and launch my install builds from the cmd line using VS post-build actions. It's not the Holy Grail, but worth every penny. And no, I don't work for Caphyon. Hope this helps.

[BrainiacV]

Like Windows NT, the NT really stood for Not There, instead of New Technology?

Psychosis at 10 Film at 11 Those who do not remember the past, are doomed to repeat it. Those who do not remember the past, cannot build upon it.