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  3. English: 3rd person singular s

English: 3rd person singular s

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  • K kalberts

    Everyone I know agrees that "Lenovo makes electronic equipment" - it is a singular company, so the 's' should be in place. Now considering Texas Instruments: "Texas Instruments makes electronic equipment", because TI is singular company (at least for this discussion), or "Texas Instruments make electronic equipment" because the name is a plural form? I asked my colleauge from London about this. To be sure, I went to my Oregon colleague for a confirmation - but got the opposite answer. So, you native English speakers from all over the world, would you say: Texas Instruments makes, or Texas Instruments make? Could this be a US vs. UK distinction - do you consider your English belonging to the "British" style, or to the "American" style? To complicate it further: Informally, we often refer to TI as "Texas" only. Is it the "Texas makes electronics" but "Texas Instruments make electronics"? What about companies mostly known by their abbreviation, but the de-abbreviation is plural: IBM make, or makes, computers? - considering that the M is for Machines The good thing is that globally considered, English is such a Babelian language that everything goes, and is for the most part understood whatever variant you choose.

    W Offline
    W Offline
    willichan
    wrote on last edited by
    #39

    Context rules. In one context, "Instruments" is a plural noun. In the context you presented, however, "Texas Instruments" is part of a name, and should be treated as a singular proper noun. In the case of the abbreviated names you mentioned, the rule holds true. Since the context has not changed, neither does the singular vs plural sentence structure. In a nutshell: if the context is that of plural entities, then use the plural sentence structure, but if the context is that of a singular entity, use the singular sentence structure. Disclosure: I was born, raised, and educated in the U.S.A. (the country with the name that can be use in either singular or plural, depending on the context) Money makes the world go round ... but documentation moves the money.

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    • K kalberts

      Everyone I know agrees that "Lenovo makes electronic equipment" - it is a singular company, so the 's' should be in place. Now considering Texas Instruments: "Texas Instruments makes electronic equipment", because TI is singular company (at least for this discussion), or "Texas Instruments make electronic equipment" because the name is a plural form? I asked my colleauge from London about this. To be sure, I went to my Oregon colleague for a confirmation - but got the opposite answer. So, you native English speakers from all over the world, would you say: Texas Instruments makes, or Texas Instruments make? Could this be a US vs. UK distinction - do you consider your English belonging to the "British" style, or to the "American" style? To complicate it further: Informally, we often refer to TI as "Texas" only. Is it the "Texas makes electronics" but "Texas Instruments make electronics"? What about companies mostly known by their abbreviation, but the de-abbreviation is plural: IBM make, or makes, computers? - considering that the M is for Machines The good thing is that globally considered, English is such a Babelian language that everything goes, and is for the most part understood whatever variant you choose.

      U Offline
      U Offline
      User 13722762
      wrote on last edited by
      #40

      If you ask them, IBM *does not* stand for International Business Machines. It used to, but it hasn't for some time now. Same for 3M and probably others. The company that was International Business Machines ceased to exist probably sometime in the 70's due to branding and legal reasons. I think AT&T is the same thing. And the answer for the "s" is that you use the "s" version any time it is a singular entity. So, Texas Instruments makes ICs. The reason is the modifier depends on the whole name not just the final "plural" word. Do not get confused by the British (English). They have this strange (to Texans and other North Americans) habit of using the plural for any entity which could be construed as a plurality of people. That is true even in cases when the name of the entity would be singular.

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      • K kalberts

        Everyone I know agrees that "Lenovo makes electronic equipment" - it is a singular company, so the 's' should be in place. Now considering Texas Instruments: "Texas Instruments makes electronic equipment", because TI is singular company (at least for this discussion), or "Texas Instruments make electronic equipment" because the name is a plural form? I asked my colleauge from London about this. To be sure, I went to my Oregon colleague for a confirmation - but got the opposite answer. So, you native English speakers from all over the world, would you say: Texas Instruments makes, or Texas Instruments make? Could this be a US vs. UK distinction - do you consider your English belonging to the "British" style, or to the "American" style? To complicate it further: Informally, we often refer to TI as "Texas" only. Is it the "Texas makes electronics" but "Texas Instruments make electronics"? What about companies mostly known by their abbreviation, but the de-abbreviation is plural: IBM make, or makes, computers? - considering that the M is for Machines The good thing is that globally considered, English is such a Babelian language that everything goes, and is for the most part understood whatever variant you choose.

        R Offline
        R Offline
        RandyBuchholz
        wrote on last edited by
        #41

        Seems clear to me. What if it was Texas Implements makes implements? Texas Implements implements implement as part of the token Texas Implements, which is singular for both implementations - implement and implements. Clear? :)

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        • U User 13722762

          If you ask them, IBM *does not* stand for International Business Machines. It used to, but it hasn't for some time now. Same for 3M and probably others. The company that was International Business Machines ceased to exist probably sometime in the 70's due to branding and legal reasons. I think AT&T is the same thing. And the answer for the "s" is that you use the "s" version any time it is a singular entity. So, Texas Instruments makes ICs. The reason is the modifier depends on the whole name not just the final "plural" word. Do not get confused by the British (English). They have this strange (to Texans and other North Americans) habit of using the plural for any entity which could be construed as a plurality of people. That is true even in cases when the name of the entity would be singular.

          T Offline
          T Offline
          thewazz
          wrote on last edited by
          #42

          Yup. I often (always?) hear Brits refer to bands and teams with 'are': The Beatles are; Abba are; Man U are; ... sounds weird to North Amer ears.

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          • G Greg Lovekamp

            Agreed. As computer professionals, our job is to keep things elegant, simple and maintainable. Why would we put a completely superfluous "u" in a word that doesn't need it?

            F Offline
            F Offline
            Forogar
            wrote on last edited by
            #43

            ..but it does need it to allow correct pronunciation - another deficiency in the American version of an otherwise excellent language. Without the 'U' then the word should be pronounced "co-law". With the 'U' then the correct "colour" is clearly defined!

            - I would love to change the world, but they won’t give me the source code.

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            • F Foothill

              I think you mean efficient, not deficient :-\

              if (Object.DividedByZero == true) { Universe.Implode(); }

              F Offline
              F Offline
              Forogar
              wrote on last edited by
              #44

              Let's just call it an "efficient deficiency", then. ;P

              - I would love to change the world, but they won’t give me the source code.

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              • F Forogar

                Let's just call it an "efficient deficiency", then. ;P

                - I would love to change the world, but they won’t give me the source code.

                F Offline
                F Offline
                Foothill
                wrote on last edited by
                #45

                That's okay, I read enough news from the BBC that the 'u' occasionally sneaks into my own 'Americanized' english. :thumbsup:

                if (Object.DividedByZero == true) { Universe.Implode(); }

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                • F Forogar

                  ..but it does need it to allow correct pronunciation - another deficiency in the American version of an otherwise excellent language. Without the 'U' then the word should be pronounced "co-law". With the 'U' then the correct "colour" is clearly defined!

                  - I would love to change the world, but they won’t give me the source code.

                  G Offline
                  G Offline
                  Greg Lovekamp
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #46

                  No, "co-law" would be ignoring the "r" on the end; that would be mispronunciation. Cambridge Dictionary: How to pronounce color in English[^]

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                  • K kalberts

                    Everyone I know agrees that "Lenovo makes electronic equipment" - it is a singular company, so the 's' should be in place. Now considering Texas Instruments: "Texas Instruments makes electronic equipment", because TI is singular company (at least for this discussion), or "Texas Instruments make electronic equipment" because the name is a plural form? I asked my colleauge from London about this. To be sure, I went to my Oregon colleague for a confirmation - but got the opposite answer. So, you native English speakers from all over the world, would you say: Texas Instruments makes, or Texas Instruments make? Could this be a US vs. UK distinction - do you consider your English belonging to the "British" style, or to the "American" style? To complicate it further: Informally, we often refer to TI as "Texas" only. Is it the "Texas makes electronics" but "Texas Instruments make electronics"? What about companies mostly known by their abbreviation, but the de-abbreviation is plural: IBM make, or makes, computers? - considering that the M is for Machines The good thing is that globally considered, English is such a Babelian language that everything goes, and is for the most part understood whatever variant you choose.

                    O Offline
                    O Offline
                    ormonds
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #47

                    In New Zealand the 's' should be used. Not to do so is in breach of some treaty, I believe.

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                    • G Greg Lovekamp

                      No, "co-law" would be ignoring the "r" on the end; that would be mispronunciation. Cambridge Dictionary: How to pronounce color in English[^]

                      F Offline
                      F Offline
                      Forogar
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #48

                      OK, how about "co-lore" then?

                      - I would love to change the world, but they won’t give me the source code.

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