Brexit: Why vote Leave
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Well, the first sensible reply! You are not the first person to be deluded by the brexiteers. Their arguments were powerfull and persuasive. The problem is: They Lied! Michael Farrage admitted as much when he stated that the money mentioned on the busses that could be better spent on the NHS, wasd a Lie! The Leave campaign was based on Lies.
Munchies_Matt wrote:
- Control of immigration, particularly extra EU. Well, the immigration of young people from the eastern acsession block, actually contribute more to the UK economy, than that they draw out. Refugees from say Syria, the problem sadly has not gone away, but, has absolutely nothing to do with EU Membership. It was one of the lies mentioned during the campaign. 2) Saving 10 billion a year (soon to be 17 billion)(so You Say, who provided you with these figures). Well, Saving membership contributions to the EU will save on the national budget.However,It is a drop in the ocean in the national budget. At any rate, it will cost more to put up border posts, employ personnel to man them, pay for duties, and collect them, Civil servants to administrate all that. border delays, etc! The cost to the economy will be enormous 3) A sense of self determination. Well, I can see that as an English Pipe dream, If there were no other issues, I would say: Go Ahead and float away to an English better destiny. 4) Ability to arrive at trade deals that suit the British economy. That is an absolute and total impossibility as long as England occupies a part of the Island of Ireland. The backstop that the English hate, but the Irish want, reflects this.
I am not issuing threats, but, merely predicting what may come from a border in Ireland, Ultimately Bombs and carnage in Liverpool, Manchester and London. The Backstop is the ultimate guarantee that such things will never happen again. The British should never forget: They occupied Ireland by action. Had they not done so 800 years ago, had they not supported the Ulster Unionists in 1922, The Island of Ireland would now be an independent state!
Bram van Kampen
Bram van Kampen wrote:
Michael Farrage admitted as much when he stated that the money mentioned on the busses that could be better spent on the NHS
Farage never made that statement in the first place, it was Boris, so he had nothing to admit. And we know Boris used the gross rather than net contribution figure. But Boris is a politician, who jumped on the bandwaggon at the last minute, Farage isnt. 1) I said control of immigration, not no immigration. We will of course continue to let in people who want to work, but we will be able to keep out criminals and scroungers. And refugees from outside the EU have everything to do with being part of the EU!!!!! Eurocrats, and Merkel welcomed them in, and then dictated how many we are to take!!!! You accuse others of lying, and then lie yourself! 2) 17 billion is not a drop in the ocean. At the height of the financial crisis we were QEing to the tune of 50 billion a year to save the economy. 3) I said a 'sense' of self determination. Whether or not people in fact have any more control over their lives is questionable, but they will feel that they do. 4) What has the Irish border got to do with whether a trade deal suits the UK or not? It has nothing to do with it. It is to do with the trade deal we have with the EU. If you think the sentiments of religious idiots in Ireland are a factor in determining the future of Britain's trade you are wrong. And in any case as we saw last week the Real IRA are planting bombs anyway, even without a hard border, so in fact the state of the border makes no difference at all and the backstop guarantees nothing. You are deluding yourself,. Look at the facts. Look, what ever gripes you have about what happened 800 years ago dont you think it is best to look to the future? That is where we are heading after all.
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Well, the first sensible reply! You are not the first person to be deluded by the brexiteers. Their arguments were powerfull and persuasive. The problem is: They Lied! Michael Farrage admitted as much when he stated that the money mentioned on the busses that could be better spent on the NHS, wasd a Lie! The Leave campaign was based on Lies.
Munchies_Matt wrote:
- Control of immigration, particularly extra EU. Well, the immigration of young people from the eastern acsession block, actually contribute more to the UK economy, than that they draw out. Refugees from say Syria, the problem sadly has not gone away, but, has absolutely nothing to do with EU Membership. It was one of the lies mentioned during the campaign. 2) Saving 10 billion a year (soon to be 17 billion)(so You Say, who provided you with these figures). Well, Saving membership contributions to the EU will save on the national budget.However,It is a drop in the ocean in the national budget. At any rate, it will cost more to put up border posts, employ personnel to man them, pay for duties, and collect them, Civil servants to administrate all that. border delays, etc! The cost to the economy will be enormous 3) A sense of self determination. Well, I can see that as an English Pipe dream, If there were no other issues, I would say: Go Ahead and float away to an English better destiny. 4) Ability to arrive at trade deals that suit the British economy. That is an absolute and total impossibility as long as England occupies a part of the Island of Ireland. The backstop that the English hate, but the Irish want, reflects this.
I am not issuing threats, but, merely predicting what may come from a border in Ireland, Ultimately Bombs and carnage in Liverpool, Manchester and London. The Backstop is the ultimate guarantee that such things will never happen again. The British should never forget: They occupied Ireland by action. Had they not done so 800 years ago, had they not supported the Ulster Unionists in 1922, The Island of Ireland would now be an independent state!
Bram van Kampen
Bram van Kampen wrote:
Michael Farrage
Is that Nigel Farage's brother? ;P
"These people looked deep within my soul and assigned me a number based on the order in which I joined." - Homer
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Bram van Kampen wrote:
Michael Farrage admitted as much when he stated that the money mentioned on the busses that could be better spent on the NHS
Farage never made that statement in the first place, it was Boris, so he had nothing to admit. And we know Boris used the gross rather than net contribution figure. But Boris is a politician, who jumped on the bandwaggon at the last minute, Farage isnt. 1) I said control of immigration, not no immigration. We will of course continue to let in people who want to work, but we will be able to keep out criminals and scroungers. And refugees from outside the EU have everything to do with being part of the EU!!!!! Eurocrats, and Merkel welcomed them in, and then dictated how many we are to take!!!! You accuse others of lying, and then lie yourself! 2) 17 billion is not a drop in the ocean. At the height of the financial crisis we were QEing to the tune of 50 billion a year to save the economy. 3) I said a 'sense' of self determination. Whether or not people in fact have any more control over their lives is questionable, but they will feel that they do. 4) What has the Irish border got to do with whether a trade deal suits the UK or not? It has nothing to do with it. It is to do with the trade deal we have with the EU. If you think the sentiments of religious idiots in Ireland are a factor in determining the future of Britain's trade you are wrong. And in any case as we saw last week the Real IRA are planting bombs anyway, even without a hard border, so in fact the state of the border makes no difference at all and the backstop guarantees nothing. You are deluding yourself,. Look at the facts. Look, what ever gripes you have about what happened 800 years ago dont you think it is best to look to the future? That is where we are heading after all.
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Munchies_Matt wrote:
keep out criminals and scroungers
Do they have signs around their necks? :-)
What they dont have are work contracts.
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What they dont have are work contracts.
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Ah OK, while we are in "cloudcuckooland" what do we do with our native "criminals and scroungers" can we send those to the EU?
Do you think this post is making you look clever after your last, and obvious, failure of thought? (Hint, you cant. Give up trying and just admit you hadnt thought of the obvious, it will go better for you that way)
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Do you think this post is making you look clever after your last, and obvious, failure of thought? (Hint, you cant. Give up trying and just admit you hadnt thought of the obvious, it will go better for you that way)
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Bram van Kampen wrote:
Michael Farrage admitted as much when he stated that the money mentioned on the busses that could be better spent on the NHS
Farage never made that statement in the first place, it was Boris, so he had nothing to admit. And we know Boris used the gross rather than net contribution figure. But Boris is a politician, who jumped on the bandwaggon at the last minute, Farage isnt. 1) I said control of immigration, not no immigration. We will of course continue to let in people who want to work, but we will be able to keep out criminals and scroungers. And refugees from outside the EU have everything to do with being part of the EU!!!!! Eurocrats, and Merkel welcomed them in, and then dictated how many we are to take!!!! You accuse others of lying, and then lie yourself! 2) 17 billion is not a drop in the ocean. At the height of the financial crisis we were QEing to the tune of 50 billion a year to save the economy. 3) I said a 'sense' of self determination. Whether or not people in fact have any more control over their lives is questionable, but they will feel that they do. 4) What has the Irish border got to do with whether a trade deal suits the UK or not? It has nothing to do with it. It is to do with the trade deal we have with the EU. If you think the sentiments of religious idiots in Ireland are a factor in determining the future of Britain's trade you are wrong. And in any case as we saw last week the Real IRA are planting bombs anyway, even without a hard border, so in fact the state of the border makes no difference at all and the backstop guarantees nothing. You are deluding yourself,. Look at the facts. Look, what ever gripes you have about what happened 800 years ago dont you think it is best to look to the future? That is where we are heading after all.
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Munchies_Matt wrote:
failure of thought
At least I had a thought, even if it was a failure, all of your posts show no thought whatsoever.
How does it feel to receive enlightenment then by someone with 'no thought'? Pretty galling I would imagine.
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How does it feel to receive enlightenment then by someone with 'no thought'? Pretty galling I would imagine.
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Well, I started a thread earlier, I am a remainer What are the arguments in favour of Leaving the EU. I can see None but Unicorns
Bram van Kampen
I'm an American. I don't have a dog in this fight.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013 -
Care to explain that?
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Care to explain that?
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Sometimes, all you need to do is completely make an ass of yourself and laugh it off to realise that life isn’t so bad after all.
Oh, I thought for a moment you were going to talk about 'max fac' (logistics). It is an interesting idea.
Mark Parity wrote:
completely make an ass of yourself and laugh it off to realise that life isn’t so bad after all
Been doing that for a long time :)
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Oh, I thought for a moment you were going to talk about 'max fac' (logistics). It is an interesting idea.
Mark Parity wrote:
completely make an ass of yourself and laugh it off to realise that life isn’t so bad after all
Been doing that for a long time :)
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Well, I started a thread earlier, I am a remainer What are the arguments in favour of Leaving the EU. I can see None but Unicorns
Bram van Kampen
Based on Tusk's recent comments hell suddenly looks a bit more appealing. Just imagine what heaven will be like with him and his pals organising everything for us Europeans.
“That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.”
― Christopher Hitchens
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Well, I started a thread earlier, I am a remainer What are the arguments in favour of Leaving the EU. I can see None but Unicorns
Bram van Kampen
Yeeeeeaaaaaah!.... Unicoooooorns!
BREAKING FAKE NEWS: Trump told the truth!
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Bram van Kampen wrote:
Michael Farrage admitted as much when he stated that the money mentioned on the busses that could be better spent on the NHS
Farage never made that statement in the first place, it was Boris, so he had nothing to admit. And we know Boris used the gross rather than net contribution figure. But Boris is a politician, who jumped on the bandwaggon at the last minute, Farage isnt. 1) I said control of immigration, not no immigration. We will of course continue to let in people who want to work, but we will be able to keep out criminals and scroungers. And refugees from outside the EU have everything to do with being part of the EU!!!!! Eurocrats, and Merkel welcomed them in, and then dictated how many we are to take!!!! You accuse others of lying, and then lie yourself! 2) 17 billion is not a drop in the ocean. At the height of the financial crisis we were QEing to the tune of 50 billion a year to save the economy. 3) I said a 'sense' of self determination. Whether or not people in fact have any more control over their lives is questionable, but they will feel that they do. 4) What has the Irish border got to do with whether a trade deal suits the UK or not? It has nothing to do with it. It is to do with the trade deal we have with the EU. If you think the sentiments of religious idiots in Ireland are a factor in determining the future of Britain's trade you are wrong. And in any case as we saw last week the Real IRA are planting bombs anyway, even without a hard border, so in fact the state of the border makes no difference at all and the backstop guarantees nothing. You are deluding yourself,. Look at the facts. Look, what ever gripes you have about what happened 800 years ago dont you think it is best to look to the future? That is where we are heading after all.
Well, Point 1. Not Entirely True. The fact is that countries like Italy and Greece took the brunt of a crisis, they could ill afford to take. I would consider it reasonable that the UK absorbs a share of that outfall. Furthermore, those refugees might look dirty exhausted and desperate, it was also the cream of society. Doctors Engineers, etc. The poor in Syria simply had no resources to make it that far. Those people would have added to the national wealth here. Point 2. If that is your point, I will not argue it. Point 3. That is merely how a point is represented to the great unwashed. Nothing to do with actual Politics. Point 4. The Irish border has to do with the entire leave project. In fact, it is Absolutely and Centrally to it! I do not know how old you are, hence I do not know what you remember, or have been told about the conflict that played here in Northern Ireland up to 25 years ago. Establishing any form of physical border here on the Island of Ireland will more than likely re-ignite that conflict. That is not a threat, not a prediction, but a fear! When that re-ignites, it will not be limited to Northern Ireland, but, to renewed Bomb Attacks in Manchester and London. I also think it best to look for the future, and forget the last 800 years. Unfortunately, I do not, and cannot speak for the idiots that would start such war, simply, because I am not part of that crowd. However, living amongst them, I know their way of thinking. Regards
Bram van Kampen
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Well, getting rid of a super privileged gold member will certainly reduce the tensions within the club.
Well, I Agree with you The Entirety of western Europe was occupied by Napoleon, who introduced the Pax Napoleon. It did away with city kingdoms, and in effect, the entire feudal system. He introduced a uniform and strictly rule based system of legal administration throughout western Europe. When after the defeat of Napoleon at Waterloo the 'Ancient Regime' returned, they inherited an efficient system of Civil Administration, tax collection, etc. They were not going to throw that out, they were going to use that, which the did. The EU without Britain comprises largely of these countries The UK missed out on that, by winning the war with Napoleon. They are as my father would have called it: "Always Crosswise in the bed". General 'De Gaule' could see that, and gave many a veto to the accession of the UK to what was then the EEG, on the grounds that the UK National Psyche was unsuitable for membership. The Republic Of Ireland (ROI) joined when the UK Joined. They had effectively no choice. The ROI has since independence been used by the UK as a vassal state, providing cheap labour. It was in a Backwater, Not joining would have meant to be in a Backwater behind a backwater Joining the EU brought the ROI suddenly enormous benefits. Whilst Margaret Tatcher was complaining about her EU Contribution, ROI was receiving billions in structural funds, to build a 21st century road and rail network. This transformed the country. By the latest poll, the Leave Vote would be 6%. Regards,
Bram van Kampen
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I'm an American. I don't have a dog in this fight.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013Well, You have a Trump to Fight. Same Target, Different Country, Different Rules, Same Principles: Populism, the bad underbelly the greeks feared about democracy!
Bram van Kampen
