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  3. C is a better language than any language you care to name.

C is a better language than any language you care to name.

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  • OriginalGriffO OriginalGriff

    No, who's on first...

    Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it. --- George Santayana (December 16, 1863 – September 26, 1952) Those who fail to clear history are doomed to explain it. --- OriginalGriff (February 24, 1959 – ∞)

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    Forogar
    wrote on last edited by
    #60

    What's on second, I Don't Know is on third... hang on! Haven't we had this discussion before?

    - I would love to change the world, but they won’t give me the source code.

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    • F Forogar

      ...and c# is pointedly better! Hmmm... that doesn't work, sharp ---> points... but there isn't much use of pointers directly so that may be a bad analogy and therefore an even worse pun! However, with puns, the worst is the best so, yeah! :-)

      - I would love to change the world, but they won’t give me the source code.

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      ZurdoDev
      wrote on last edited by
      #61

      Everything you said is nonsense and gibberish and yet I perfectly understood you. :) :thumbsup:

      There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.

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      • J Joe Woodbury

        Written by Walter Bright, who invented D and is still tilting at windmills over it. He's wrong. Arrays are pointers. Period. That's how they really are and to pretend they are something special or different is absurd. What's even more absurd is his claim that they "...and lose the information which gives the extent of the array - the array dimension." THEY NEVER HAD IT (unless a developer decided to make the array that way.) It's the very definition of a strawman argument. If you don't understand pointers, just say so and use a language "without" them (ha! all computer languages end up using pointers, they just hide them.)

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        Nemanja Trifunovic
        wrote on last edited by
        #62

        Joe Woodbury wrote:

        Arrays are pointers

        Joe Woodbury wrote:

        the information which gives the extent of the array - the array dimension." THEY NEVER HAD IT

        char *p = "hello"; //pointer - no information about the dimension
        char q[] = "hello"; // array - contains information about the dimension

        printf("%zu\n", sizeof(p)); // => size of pointer to char -- 4 on x86, 8 on x86-64
        printf("%zu\n", sizeof(q)); // => size of char array in memory -- 6 on both

        utf8-cpp

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        • N Nemanja Trifunovic

          Joe Woodbury wrote:

          Arrays are pointers

          Joe Woodbury wrote:

          the information which gives the extent of the array - the array dimension." THEY NEVER HAD IT

          char *p = "hello"; //pointer - no information about the dimension
          char q[] = "hello"; // array - contains information about the dimension

          printf("%zu\n", sizeof(p)); // => size of pointer to char -- 4 on x86, 8 on x86-64
          printf("%zu\n", sizeof(q)); // => size of char array in memory -- 6 on both

          utf8-cpp

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          Joe Woodbury
          wrote on last edited by
          #63

          Nemanja Trifunovic wrote:

          char *p = "hello"; //pointer - no information about the dimension char q[] = "hello"; // array - contains information about the dimension

          No the ARRAY does not. The declaration does and thus the precompiler) and sizeof(), but not the array itself. To illustrate, the function:

          void _function(const char r[])
          {
          printf("%u\n", sizeof(r));
          }

          Will print 4 or 8, depending on the size of a pointer, when you call _function(q);. Added: Moreover, an optimizing compiler will likely pool both strings and use the same pointer for both operations (especially since it's clear they are both const.) Again, the sizeof() is handled by the precompiler, not at runtime.

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          • C Chris Maunder

            Discuss. I've just read The Unreasonable Effectiveness of C[^] and decided to outsource my ranting response to it

            cheers Chris Maunder

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            Member 4194593
            wrote on last edited by
            #64

            It may be fast, but not as fast as MASM. Just look at some of the created code in the .cod listing. Many, many, pipeline stalls in code initialization where a push and pop of ebx would free that reg to share loading eax, then ebx, then saving eax, then saving ebx, and this was in optimized code in a high use function in JKDEFRAG. I'll stick with MASM. Dave.

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            • F Forogar

              What's on second, I Don't Know is on third... hang on! Haven't we had this discussion before?

              - I would love to change the world, but they won’t give me the source code.

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              Karen Mitchelle
              wrote on last edited by
              #65

              :laugh: yeah. You had. And it makes me laugh even for the second time. Told you, I have weird humor. ;)

              Don't mind those people who say you're not HOT. At least you know you're COOL. I'm not afraid of falling, I'm afraid of the sudden stop at the end of the fall! - Richard Andrew x64

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              • C Chris Maunder

                Discuss. I've just read The Unreasonable Effectiveness of C[^] and decided to outsource my ranting response to it

                cheers Chris Maunder

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                Karen Mitchelle
                wrote on last edited by
                #66

                Ahm, how about this language[^]? :)

                Don't mind those people who say you're not HOT. At least you know you're COOL. I'm not afraid of falling, I'm afraid of the sudden stop at the end of the fall! - Richard Andrew x64

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                • R Ravi Bhavnani

                  Isn't that "bettor"? /ravi

                  My new year resolution: 2048 x 1536 Home | Articles | My .NET bits | Freeware ravib(at)ravib(dot)com

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                  Roger Wright
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #67

                  I'm not sure, but I'll ask my Grammar when she's done baking cookies.

                  Will Rogers never met me.

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                  • R Roger Wright

                    I'm not sure, but I'll ask my Grammar when she's done baking cookies.

                    Will Rogers never met me.

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                    Ravi Bhavnani
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #68

                    Baking cookies?  I usually just add them to a response. ;P /ravi

                    My new year resolution: 2048 x 1536 Home | Articles | My .NET bits | Freeware ravib(at)ravib(dot)com

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                    • C Chris Maunder

                      Discuss. I've just read The Unreasonable Effectiveness of C[^] and decided to outsource my ranting response to it

                      cheers Chris Maunder

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                      Vivi Chellappa
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #69

                      'C' was its grade as a a programming language. C++ got a grade of C-- ;P

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                      • C Chris Maunder

                        Discuss. I've just read The Unreasonable Effectiveness of C[^] and decided to outsource my ranting response to it

                        cheers Chris Maunder

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                        PIEBALDconsult
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #70

                        I agree. Granted that may be because I don't care to name any others.

                        You'll never get very far if all you do is follow instructions.

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                        • Z ZurdoDev

                          Everything you said is nonsense and gibberish and yet I perfectly understood you. :) :thumbsup:

                          There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.

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                          Lost User
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #71

                          Are you a VB Code reviewer? :p

                          Z 1 Reply Last reply
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                          • C Chris Maunder

                            Discuss. I've just read The Unreasonable Effectiveness of C[^] and decided to outsource my ranting response to it

                            cheers Chris Maunder

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                            Rutvik Dave
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #72

                            Chris, I am afraid you have the wrong information. C is not a language, it's an alphabet.

                            Remind Me This - Manage, Collaborate and Execute your Project in the Cloud

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                            • R Rutvik Dave

                              Chris, I am afraid you have the wrong information. C is not a language, it's an alphabet.

                              Remind Me This - Manage, Collaborate and Execute your Project in the Cloud

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                              Roger Wright
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #73

                              Rutvik Dave wrote:

                              C is not a language, it's an alphabet.

                              Actually, it is just one element in a set called an "alphabet." We also have a 'D' and 24 other members in the set.

                              Will Rogers never met me.

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                              • S snorkie

                                C is for COOKIE

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                                Argonia
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #74

                                So C++ is for two cookies? (cookie++ ; ) ;)

                                Microsoft ... the only place where VARIANT_TRUE != true

                                1 Reply Last reply
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                                • C Chris Maunder

                                  Discuss. I've just read The Unreasonable Effectiveness of C[^] and decided to outsource my ranting response to it

                                  cheers Chris Maunder

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                                  Peter Adam
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #75

                                  The vast majority of the software out there is written in C. The vast majority of software out there has crippling flaws, are out of budget and abandoned after tried to use. QED ;P

                                  1 Reply Last reply
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                                  • D DaveAuld

                                    Chris Maunder wrote:

                                    C is a better language than any language you care to name

                                    No, I think I would much rather talk to someone using English. :rolleyes:

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                                    Simon ORiordan from UK
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #76

                                    printf("Why is that then?");

                                    S 1 Reply Last reply
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                                    • C Chris Maunder

                                      Discuss. I've just read The Unreasonable Effectiveness of C[^] and decided to outsource my ranting response to it

                                      cheers Chris Maunder

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                                      Michael Kingsford Gray
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #77

                                      OK, I'll "bite". "C" is quite the most disastrous so-called "language"[1] ever to become popular. Why? It's total lack of marshalling over record boundaries in memory have cost the globe at least several 100 trillion dollars in viruses, damages, fornicate-ups, interminable repairs/patches, Trojans, injuries, deaths, et cetera. That alone is enough to relegate this incurable abortion of a syntactical nightmare to the bit-bucket, if not Spandau prison. Have at it, you "C" devils. ___________________________ [1] Designed for punch-card use, brevity & conservation of card-space were essential. It thereby became an impenetrably terse & line-break free mess. All calculated to save IBM punched cards. And the syntax is dangerously ambiguous, all over the shop. Don't get me started on the monumentally bone-headed notion that CASE statements should cascade through without a BREAK clause! I mean. What total idiot "thought" that this would be a great idea?

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                                      • C Chris Maunder

                                        Discuss. I've just read The Unreasonable Effectiveness of C[^] and decided to outsource my ranting response to it

                                        cheers Chris Maunder

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                                        Lost User
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #78

                                        Always was and always will be. IMHO. :-O

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                                        • J Joe Woodbury

                                          Garbage collection is a flaw, not a feature. It not only sucks resources, it creates a huge unknown. Some of the most difficult problems I've dealt with were with garbage collection (in one recent case, we never did solve the problem--some the most brilliant engineers I know also failed to solve it. Around the same time, we tracked things back to a lesser known bug in the .NET 4.0 garbage collector.)

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                                          BobJanova
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #79

                                          Well no, it's a feature. GCd environments eliminate a large group of common bugs, free the developer to think about higher level stuff and not litter their code with memory management cruft, and are in general a Good Thing. It's just that it's a feature that, in certain particular circumstances (particularly when resource usage is tight), isn't helpful.

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