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  3. "I refuse to work in C#"

"I refuse to work in C#"

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csharppythonvisual-studiocomlinux
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  • M Marc Clifton

    > my god, I have to actually install Visual Studio and work in an IDE? No way. I want to work from the command line for development, and if you want to use C# for the back end, I'm not going to help you. Yes indeed, I heard that on Friday from a Linux guy who is trying to push for a Django / Python back end at the company I'm working at. Fucking script-kiddies. Marc

    Imperative to Functional Programming Succinctly Contributors Wanted for Higher Order Programming Project!

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    SeattleC
    wrote on last edited by
    #82

    If your colleague really wants to be an idiot, there's nothing stopping them from using some antique line-oriented editor (remember DEC's SOS editor from the 1970s?, or maybe emacs on a VT-100 terminal) to edit their program and using visual studio's command-line tools to compile it. There's even a way to install just the command-line compiler and linker. Horrible as it sounds, that's how google's Chromium project compiles for windows. I suspect your colleague's disdain for C# probably goes deeper than that. Visual Studio's IDE is really quite productive, though I also like Eclipse (when it isn't crashing on me). Sigh.

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    • M Marc Clifton

      > my god, I have to actually install Visual Studio and work in an IDE? No way. I want to work from the command line for development, and if you want to use C# for the back end, I'm not going to help you. Yes indeed, I heard that on Friday from a Linux guy who is trying to push for a Django / Python back end at the company I'm working at. Fucking script-kiddies. Marc

      Imperative to Functional Programming Succinctly Contributors Wanted for Higher Order Programming Project!

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      rodrigo_orem
      wrote on last edited by
      #83

      I think you guys are missing the point. A good text editor has nothing to do with notepad (I think notepad++ isn't a satisfactory improvement). I work daily with SublimeText, and I assure you I'm more productive and learned a lot than when I used Visual Studio/C#. Like your coworker, I defended a platform change in our company. We have successfully migrated our C# solution, that ran only in Windows, in a Django/Python service. I had fights with my teammates at the time, it wasn't a soft transition, but there's a lot of advantages, we ship code better and faster than never. I doubt that anyone code in Visual Studio faster than an expert vim programmer. I've seen one of them in a Google keynote about Angular.js, they are insanely fast. There's no reason to develop a serious application in a closed platform, which project itself is a great failure (they copied the JIT compiler thing from Java, except that Java does it because it's multiplatform, opposed to .NET -- Mono is buggy and very very unofficial). The worst part is that a single company that controls everything. The best thing that happened to software development was open source, an having a good community around it makes the difference The community around C# is poor, partially because they can't have a role in the language/framework development. "Open source" doesn't mean I'm saying "linux rules windows sucks", I'm talking about reusing code/components from someone else. You do it everyday, except that the guys who write the code you reuse are Microsoft employees pressed to keep old standards, the code that I use are from passionated developers around the world.

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      • M Marc Clifton

        > my god, I have to actually install Visual Studio and work in an IDE? No way. I want to work from the command line for development, and if you want to use C# for the back end, I'm not going to help you. Yes indeed, I heard that on Friday from a Linux guy who is trying to push for a Django / Python back end at the company I'm working at. Fucking script-kiddies. Marc

        Imperative to Functional Programming Succinctly Contributors Wanted for Higher Order Programming Project!

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        drumzzzzz_39
        wrote on last edited by
        #84

        Suppose, if you really wanted to, one could draw an entire 2015 Dodge Viper in 3d via the Autocad commandline, Of course most would likely prefer the IDE ;P

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        • R RASPeter

          Luxury! I had a TRS-80 with no tape drive and a broken game cartridge slot. Literally all I could do with it was type in BASIC programs that would disappear as soon as I switched it off.

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          Edwin Smith
          wrote on last edited by
          #85

          I had a KIM-1 with 4 KB memory. No disk, no tape. Just a hex keypad and a 6 X 7 segment display. After an hour of hand keying in the program you could play Hunt the Wumpus!

          There are 10 kinds of people in the world. Those who understand binary and those who don't.

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          • U User 10300468

            It could always be worse. You could be required to build an app with nothing but Access and macros. It's like opening that nice red toolbox and finding only a bag of sporks.

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            englebart
            wrote on last edited by
            #86

            Is there a macro that could be used to call Access VBA? "Wow, you did all of this with a single line of macros." [and a few hundred lines of "real" code]

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            • M Marc Clifton

              > my god, I have to actually install Visual Studio and work in an IDE? No way. I want to work from the command line for development, and if you want to use C# for the back end, I'm not going to help you. Yes indeed, I heard that on Friday from a Linux guy who is trying to push for a Django / Python back end at the company I'm working at. Fucking script-kiddies. Marc

              Imperative to Functional Programming Succinctly Contributors Wanted for Higher Order Programming Project!

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              englebart
              wrote on last edited by
              #87

              You do not need an IDE to program C#. You can always use any text editor and csc.exe. (C-Sharp Compiler) If you have dotNET, you have csc.exe.

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              • P PIEBALDconsult

                Oh, now you've stepped in it... I have a MicroVAX 3100 (circa 1986) with 8MB RAM and two 1GB HDDs and VAX BASIC installed. :cool:

                VAX BASIC V3.9-000

                Ready

                print 6*7
                42
                Ready

                10 for i = 1 to 10
                20 print "Hello, world!"
                30 next i
                runnh

                Hello, world!
                Hello, world!
                Hello, world!
                Hello, world!
                Hello, world!
                Hello, world!
                Hello, world!
                Hello, world!
                Hello, world!
                Hello, world!
                Ready

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                Member_5893260
                wrote on last edited by
                #88

                Whoa! With that sort of advanced capability, you'll even be able to run "Adventure For The Stupid" (tm): 10 print "You are in a cave..." 20 line input I$ 30 goto 10

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                • E englebart

                  Is there a macro that could be used to call Access VBA? "Wow, you did all of this with a single line of macros." [and a few hundred lines of "real" code]

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                  User 10300468
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #89

                  Tempting, but the boss at the time was too savvy for that kind of sneakiness.

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                  • E Edwin Smith

                    I had a KIM-1 with 4 KB memory. No disk, no tape. Just a hex keypad and a 6 X 7 segment display. After an hour of hand keying in the program you could play Hunt the Wumpus!

                    There are 10 kinds of people in the world. Those who understand binary and those who don't.

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                    RASPeter
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #90

                    In my first programming class we had these workstations with an 8080A, an octal keypad, and 3 rows of 8 LEDs (with pin-outs if you wanted to be fancy and wire up a 7-segment). I can't seem to find it on Google, though.

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                    • R RASPeter

                      In my first programming class we had these workstations with an 8080A, an octal keypad, and 3 rows of 8 LEDs (with pin-outs if you wanted to be fancy and wire up a 7-segment). I can't seem to find it on Google, though.

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                      lesNZ
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #91

                      My first computer (actually my employers) was a Burroughs main frame (!) with 9.6k memory, no disk, mag tapes, no operating system.

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                      • R RASPeter

                        In my first programming class we had these workstations with an 8080A, an octal keypad, and 3 rows of 8 LEDs (with pin-outs if you wanted to be fancy and wire up a 7-segment). I can't seem to find it on Google, though.

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                        GStrad
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #92

                        I used a similar set up called a D5 if I remember right, 6802 based though

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                        • L lesNZ

                          My first computer (actually my employers) was a Burroughs main frame (!) with 9.6k memory, no disk, mag tapes, no operating system.

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                          MKJCP
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #93

                          My first computer was a simple Base 10 analog machine. It had 2 parts attached to the end of my arms. I still have it and use it when I don't want to be bothered with an IDE to hammer screws in or pound nails with a screwdriver.

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                          • M MKJCP

                            My first computer was a simple Base 10 analog machine. It had 2 parts attached to the end of my arms. I still have it and use it when I don't want to be bothered with an IDE to hammer screws in or pound nails with a screwdriver.

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                            Mark I
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #94

                            I think that should be classed as 'digit'al, not analogue.

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                            • B Basketcase Software

                              I can't resist. My first machine was a Commodore Vic-20... with 3.5K of user RAM and built in BASIC.

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                              Yvan Rodrigues
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #95

                              Me too! 70s kids REPRESENT! (I was pretty jealous later when all my friends got Commodore 64s. :|

                              Yvan Rodrigues, C.Tech. Red Cell Innovation Inc.

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                              • R robj98021

                                I can't resist as well... My first computer was a Sinclair ZX-81, with the 16KB add on memory module. That and a realistic cassette deck were all that were needed to ensure productivity never faltered.

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                                Olfello
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #96

                                I can't resist as well: started with a PDP-8 with 8kB Memory (real magnetic rings with 4 wires...) and punch tape.

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                                • M MKJCP

                                  My first computer was a simple Base 10 analog machine. It had 2 parts attached to the end of my arms. I still have it and use it when I don't want to be bothered with an IDE to hammer screws in or pound nails with a screwdriver.

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                                  lesNZ
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #97

                                  Fingers? You were lucky to have fingers. Luxury!

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                                  • P PIEBALDconsult

                                    I have no respect for developers who claim they couldn't possibly develop without the latest IDE and related tools. Do more with less. I use Visual Studio only when I need to (WinForms and SSIS), but all my other C# I do old-school*. And I prefer to do primarily back-end, library, utility stuff. I can send him a copy of the simple IDE I wrote -- I use it for C#, C, and VB. I'm sure it can do other languages (basically all you need to do is tell it how to call the compiler). (Sorry, no article is forthcoming at this time.) * No syntax highlighting, no code folding, no debugger, no designer, no intellisense, no real-time syntax checking, just raw like a chopped panhead yo. :cool: Like turbo C, except Turbo C has a debugger.

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                                    TheGreatAndPowerfulOz
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #98

                                    Well, for that he (and you) can just install Atom.io[^]

                                    Decrease the belief in God, and you increase the numbers of those who wish to play at being God by being “society’s supervisors,” who deny the existence of divine standards, but are very serious about imposing their own standards on society.-Neal A. Maxwell You must accept 1 of 2 basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe or we are not alone. Either way, the implications are staggering!-Wernher von Braun

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                                    • T TheGreatAndPowerfulOz

                                      Well, for that he (and you) can just install Atom.io[^]

                                      Decrease the belief in God, and you increase the numbers of those who wish to play at being God by being “society’s supervisors,” who deny the existence of divine standards, but are very serious about imposing their own standards on society.-Neal A. Maxwell You must accept 1 of 2 basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe or we are not alone. Either way, the implications are staggering!-Wernher von Braun

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                                      PIEBALDconsult
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #99

                                      I think I looked at that a few years ago.

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                                      • P PIEBALDconsult

                                        I think I looked at that a few years ago.

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                                        TheGreatAndPowerfulOz
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #100

                                        A few "years" ago? :omg: It's only just recently been released... Perhaps you're a time traveler?:thumbsup:

                                        Decrease the belief in God, and you increase the numbers of those who wish to play at being God by being “society’s supervisors,” who deny the existence of divine standards, but are very serious about imposing their own standards on society.-Neal A. Maxwell You must accept 1 of 2 basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe or we are not alone. Either way, the implications are staggering!-Wernher von Braun

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                                        • T TheGreatAndPowerfulOz

                                          A few "years" ago? :omg: It's only just recently been released... Perhaps you're a time traveler?:thumbsup:

                                          Decrease the belief in God, and you increase the numbers of those who wish to play at being God by being “society’s supervisors,” who deny the existence of divine standards, but are very serious about imposing their own standards on society.-Neal A. Maxwell You must accept 1 of 2 basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe or we are not alone. Either way, the implications are staggering!-Wernher von Braun

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                                          P Offline
                                          PIEBALDconsult
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #101

                                          Well, it sounds like something I looked at a few years ago. Maybe someone stole the name? Or one was built on the ruins of the other? Or maybe I'm thinking of this: http://www.codeproject.com/Messages/4767960/Introducing-Atom.aspx[^]

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