Avant Browser - pros and cons
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I figured FF would come out with a script for that sooner or later. FF uses a hell of a lot more memory than that. I've caught FF using 2 gigs+ on multiple occassions. I open FF when I need to and close it when I'm done. - Rex
Some assembly required. Code-frog System Architects, Inc.
code-frog wrote:
I've caught FF using 2 gigs+ on multiple occassions
Wow. I've never seen that happen.
And that's not all. I just discovered this cool concept called "object oriented design". I can't wait to convert my subroutines to class methods! :-D -Ravi Bhavnani on finally installing XP SP2...in December 2005
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Naw, FF and CP are both innocent - David just can't get his HTML right... ;P
Calvin's my hero. It used to be Shog but then I saw where he made a programming mistake and admitted it publicly. I didn't know Shog made mistakes so now he's 2nd on "The All Time Hero List" and Calvin is back at #1. - code-frog, Calling Cookie Experts...
Thanks. Hey, does CPhog work with FF 1.5? I'm not seeing the Quick Reply and all that I used to see, although I do see the monkey down in the corner of the status bar. *edit* Nevermind, just had to restart a couple times. It's working now. Awesome little tool by the way. :cool:
Tech, life, family, faith: Give me a visit. I'm currently blogging about: Bought a House! Judah Himango
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Thanks. Hey, does CPhog work with FF 1.5? I'm not seeing the Quick Reply and all that I used to see, although I do see the monkey down in the corner of the status bar. *edit* Nevermind, just had to restart a couple times. It's working now. Awesome little tool by the way. :cool:
Tech, life, family, faith: Give me a visit. I'm currently blogging about: Bought a House! Judah Himango
And that's not all. I just discovered this cool concept called "object oriented design". I can't wait to convert my subroutines to class methods! :-D -Ravi Bhavnani on finally installing XP SP2...in December 2005
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andy brummer wrote:
If you don't deal with HTML and web development often then IE is just fine.
Can you shed some more light on that. i do a lot of HTML, web development but normally stick to HTML tables and java scripts :) What is the difference ? , thanks "Not everything that counts can be counted..." -Albert Einstein
Quartz... wrote:
What is the difference ?
Top of my list:
- Leak-free closures
- Combo boxes that can be styled and aren't perpetually at the top of the z-order
- Use XPath on HTML documents
- Web Developer toolbar and DOM Inspector
- Support for handy CSS selectors and pseudo elements
- Better PNG support
position: fixed;- E4X
----- I just want you to be happy, That's my only little wish...
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Excellent points about the UI.
With repsect to your comments about writing error messages and the Reporter...I'm thinking this is a bit different. The Mozilla Foundation isn't really blaming the user...they're blaming the content providers for providing IE only content...which, IMO, is where the blame needs to go. I don't think the blame should go on Mozilla, Apple, Opera, the KHTML folks, or anybody else for not providing rendering engines that act exactly like IE's. Web Devs who ignorantly assume that their user base is only going to hit their site with IE are the ones to blame. And there are ways to minimize the amount of double-coding necessary to support all of those browsers.
And that's not all. I just discovered this cool concept called "object oriented design". I can't wait to convert my subroutines to class methods! :-D -Ravi Bhavnani on finally installing XP SP2...in December 2005
I hear what you say, but I think my point still stands. In writing an error message (e.g. for a desktop app, and yes, this case is slightly different), you (as the application) take the blame yourself. So, not:
You have specified an incorrect location to save the file.but:WhizzyApp was unable to save the file. The folder does not exist.and I don't see Firefox going that far. They aren't taking responsibility for the problem. In the example above, it's not the application's fault that the user has given a bad location for the file, but the program takes responsibility anyway. It's subtle wording like that that makes all the difference about how applications are percieved, especically by non-technical users. -
And that's not all. I just discovered this cool concept called "object oriented design". I can't wait to convert my subroutines to class methods! :-D -Ravi Bhavnani on finally installing XP SP2...in December 2005
Yes, and oddly enough, for some reason I'm now seeing the quick reply. I swear, it was not there the last time I ran FF. Maybe I just had to restart it a couple times. X| Thanks.
Tech, life, family, faith: Give me a visit. I'm currently blogging about: Bought a House! Judah Himango
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I don't use the reply page for posting. But yes, the QST button is broken. It looks like there was a regression between 1.0.x and 1.5 in which the selected text was cleared when you clicked a form element. There's a workaround that Shog and I have both sent to Chris...but he's been on vacation for a bit...so it might be a bit before he fixes it.
In the interim...you could always try out Greasemonkey and CPhog. :)
And that's not all. I just discovered this cool concept called "object oriented design". I can't wait to convert my subroutines to class methods! :-D -Ravi Bhavnani on finally installing XP SP2...in December 2005
David Stone wrote:
you could always try out Greasemonkey and CPhog.
Yeah, I had been using it until 1.5, then it seemed to stop working (even after GM 0.6.4). I think I might've had an old version of CPhog though, just upgraded and after a few restarts it does seem to work. I didn't realize Quote Selected Text is different under CPhog. That's great, it does appear to work (as I just quoted you above) :cool: Now, how do I add my sig to Quick Reply?
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Quartz... wrote:
What is the difference ?
Top of my list:
- Leak-free closures
- Combo boxes that can be styled and aren't perpetually at the top of the z-order
- Use XPath on HTML documents
- Web Developer toolbar and DOM Inspector
- Support for handy CSS selectors and pseudo elements
- Better PNG support
position: fixed;- E4X
----- I just want you to be happy, That's my only little wish...
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Quartz... wrote:
What is the difference ?
Top of my list:
- Leak-free closures
- Combo boxes that can be styled and aren't perpetually at the top of the z-order
- Use XPath on HTML documents
- Web Developer toolbar and DOM Inspector
- Support for handy CSS selectors and pseudo elements
- Better PNG support
position: fixed;- E4X
----- I just want you to be happy, That's my only little wish...
If FF has the support for all the latest advanced technologies, why is not compatible with a lot of simple websites out there ? and why does IE Scores there , though its not even near as good development environment as FF ? For a layman, A Web browser should display the web page properly first then only he can appreciate the advantages of tons of feature given by that browser. "Not everything that counts can be counted..." -Albert Einstein
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David Stone wrote:
you could always try out Greasemonkey and CPhog.
Yeah, I had been using it until 1.5, then it seemed to stop working (even after GM 0.6.4). I think I might've had an old version of CPhog though, just upgraded and after a few restarts it does seem to work. I didn't realize Quote Selected Text is different under CPhog. That's great, it does appear to work (as I just quoted you above) :cool: Now, how do I add my sig to Quick Reply?
Judah Himango wrote:
Now, how do I add my sig to Quick Reply?
Copy it from the box on your settings page and then paste it into the signature box on Quick Reply. :)
----- Calvin's my hero. It used to be Shog but then I saw where he made a programming mistake and admitted it publicly. I didn't know Shog made mistakes so now he's 2nd on "The All Time Hero List" and Calvin is back at #1. - code-frog, Calling Cookie Experts...
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Judah Himango wrote:
Now, how do I add my sig to Quick Reply?
Copy it from the box on your settings page and then paste it into the signature box on Quick Reply. :)
----- Calvin's my hero. It used to be Shog but then I saw where he made a programming mistake and admitted it publicly. I didn't know Shog made mistakes so now he's 2nd on "The All Time Hero List" and Calvin is back at #1. - code-frog, Calling Cookie Experts...
Ah, it doesn't save then?
Tech, life, family, faith: Give me a visit. I'm currently blogging about: Bought a House! Judah Himango
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Ah, it doesn't save then?
Tech, life, family, faith: Give me a visit. I'm currently blogging about: Bought a House! Judah Himango
Judah Himango wrote:
Ah, it doesn't save then?
It does. Or at least...it should. Does on mine...
And that's not all. I just discovered this cool concept called "object oriented design". I can't wait to convert my subroutines to class methods! :-D -Ravi Bhavnani on finally installing XP SP2...in December 2005
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If FF has the support for all the latest advanced technologies, why is not compatible with a lot of simple websites out there ? and why does IE Scores there , though its not even near as good development environment as FF ? For a layman, A Web browser should display the web page properly first then only he can appreciate the advantages of tons of feature given by that browser. "Not everything that counts can be counted..." -Albert Einstein
Quartz... wrote:
If FF has the support for all the latest advanced technologies, why is not compatible with a lot of simple websites out there ?
There are a number of contributing factors, but a big portion of it boils down to this: A good number of web pages out there have been designed by people with rather poor technical skills. When you have an error in (say) a C++ program, it might not compile, or it might crash. When you have a bug in a HTML page, it might display oddly. How oddly depends on the underlying design of the rendering engine, and on decisions made regarding how errors would be handled. Here's a very common example:
<div><font color="blue">The closing tags
<b><i> are out of order!</font></i>
And one of them is missing...<div>This is invalid HTML. Both IE and FF do their best to display *something*, and usually they get results that are pretty close... But in some instances, there are differences in the final output. Arguing over which is more "correct" is pointless. The more troublesome inconsistencies spring from practices that, at one time, *were* valid - for instance, pages written for IE 4.x or Netscape 4.x. Many of the features introduced in those browsers were later standardized on and made available by both... but a fair number of them weren't. So a browser-maker has to make a decision: support a feature that has no formal specification and/or is no longer common? Sometimes it's fairly easy - Netscape's LAYER tags were part of a DHTML implementation that was less powerful and more convoluted than the solution finally standardized on: drop it. MARQUEE tags were never standardized on either, but are used heavily in many East Asian sites, and can make them unusable if not supported - so keep support for them. Other times, it's tricky - one of the features of IE4 that is still heavily used to this day is the
document.allauto-array, which can be used to iterate through every element in a document, or choose a specific one by id. It was superseded in v5.0 browsers bydocument.getElementById()and friends, but still persists as a sort of shorthand in a lot of code. The problem is, if a fully IE-compatible implementation of it were put into Mozilla, it might break code written with cross-browser compatibility in mind! This is worse than breaking on IE-only sites, since it does nothing to encourage programmers to write better code, but adds yet ano -
It just doesn't feel right to me. What annoys:
- There's a number of UI inconsistencies (a particular bugbear of mine)
- It doesn't import cookies properly (it broke some "saved logon" sites)
- It doesn't hande CP's menus or quote selected text feature
What really annoys: This is a quote from the "Report a broken web site" feature
This tool allows you to tell the Evangelism Team about web sites that do not work properly in Firefox
The clear implication here is that if Firefox does not render a site properly, it's the fault of the web site. Seems arrogant to me. What I find funny: (from the install log)
Components corrupted (startup): noney‚|
Destination Path:
Main: C:\Program Files\Mozilla Firefox
SubPath:I got a real giggle from the fact that there's clearly some corruption in the file :doh:
Graham Bradshaw wrote:
The clear implication here is that if Firefox does not render a site properly, it's the fault of the web site. Seems arrogant to me.
Perhaps. But, fairly honest. Probably 7-8 times out of 10, if i find a website isn't working right in FF it's doing something dodgy or down-right stupid. The rest of the time, it's a bug in FF or a missing plug-in. Why is it a good idea to put a bit of the blame on site owners? Because for some sites, no matter how good FF gets at emulating IE's behavior, there are going to be problems unless the site owner is serious about wanting it to work cross-platform. Consider the recent open beta of Windows Live, and the soon-to-be beta of Windows Live Mail: The former took a good deal of flack for launching without proper FF support, and quickly updated to correct it. The latter is planned to support FF by the time it goes public. Maybe i'm just an arrogant, demanding user, but having a site come up working for me is *always* more important than getting a diplomatically-worded blurb in some "report broken page" dialog... ;)
----- Calvin's my hero. It used to be Shog but then I saw where he made a programming mistake and admitted it publicly. I didn't know Shog made mistakes so now he's 2nd on "The All Time Hero List" and Calvin is back at #1. - code-frog, Calling Cookie Experts...
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Ah, it doesn't save then?
Tech, life, family, faith: Give me a visit. I'm currently blogging about: Bought a House! Judah Himango
There was a bit of a bug with that. It *should* have saved when you posted a reply using it, but i've updated the code to save even more often just in case. Reload CP to refresh the code, and let me know if you run into any more problems.
----- Calvin's my hero. It used to be Shog but then I saw where he made a programming mistake and admitted it publicly. I didn't know Shog made mistakes so now he's 2nd on "The All Time Hero List" and Calvin is back at #1. - code-frog, Calling Cookie Experts...
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I know FireFox users hate IE (not the IE users i presume :) ) I tried avant browser after a message by Marc here[^]and i am finding it with loads of extended features which IE users always wanted to have at a single place. I would say its Definitely not for FF users because its too sophisticated and a bit complicated interface,due to enhanced feature list, but for IE users this adds an immense features all IE users always wanted. 1st the "The Con's " 1. Seems to be too cluttered (Firefox or IE Interface is much simpler) 2. Somebody said it crashes (but not till now i have used it for three days) 3. It is 100% based on Internet Explorer, it actually extends the IE using inbuilt BHO. 4. There are two tabs which are really horrible a> Yahoo search tab (may be somebody find it useful but you can hide it) b> Similar website (This one actually is a bit cluttery one you might see you can hide this one too ) might show a set of squares as if loading something 5. I am not sure about this one but i am unable to use the Answers.com toolbar in Avant. ( may be i have to reinstall it) 6..Add your cons here...... The Pro's 1. Tabbed browsing 2. Based on IE - Works on all the websites where IE works 3. In built Google search tab 4. you don't have to import/export anything everything in IE is automatically there 5. One cick- you can hide/ close all the browsers to the system tray 6. One click all features of tabbed browsing, 7. And yes it is faster than IE 8. capable to Block "In the page " Flash or even image Ads in the page 9. Zoom in zoom out any image in the page 10. mouseover text in the page and a floating option of search etc. 11. Feeds Menu like favorite menu 12. And Ofcourse the Cool Skins.... 13..Add your pros here....... For all the IE users its bliss. Friends, Romans and all the fellow FF users please don't shoot me for using extended IE like browser, we can live side by side :) "Not everything that counts can be counted..." -Albert Einstein -- modified at 18:01 Monday 5th December, 2005
I used to use Avant before I switched to Firefox - and if Firefox were to somehow (God forbid!) suddenly disappear, I would definitely go back to using it. It was a ray of hope in the stagnant browser world before Firefox made its debut. But Firefox with a few plugins has all of its features, plus there are a host of other plugins, and I can write my own easily if I want new features. And the underlying engine has a lot of extra features that can't be retrofitted into IE. The only major thing I dislike about Firefox now is the memory usage, which is still too high. (Its resource use is low though, and that's what really counts because resources can't be increased, but memory can.)
Quartz... wrote:
1. Seems to be too cluttered (Firefox or IE Interface is much simpler)
Yes - IE has fewer features, and Firefox has the same features but presents them in a less cluttered way.
Quartz... wrote:
2. Based on IE - Works on all the websites where IE works
"Based on IE" is both a pro and a con to me - it's a pro only when I need to access a site that is coded for IE only.
Quartz... wrote:
4. you don't have to import/export anything everything in IE is automatically there
Part of (2), but note that import from IE to Firefox is painless.
Quartz... wrote:
5. One cick- you can hide/ close all the browsers to the system tray
Not something I'm interested in, but there is a plugin that does it.
Quartz... wrote:
6. One click all features of tabbed browsing
Which contributes to the clutter.
Quartz... wrote:
10. mouseover text in the page and a floating option of search etc.
Not sure what you're referring to...
Quartz... wrote:
3. In built Google search tab
Quartz... wrote:
5. One cick- you can hide/ close all the browsers to the system tray
Quartz... wrote:
8. capable to Block "In the page " Flash or even image Ads in the page
Quartz... wrote:
11. Feeds Menu like favorite menu
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I know FireFox users hate IE (not the IE users i presume :) ) I tried avant browser after a message by Marc here[^]and i am finding it with loads of extended features which IE users always wanted to have at a single place. I would say its Definitely not for FF users because its too sophisticated and a bit complicated interface,due to enhanced feature list, but for IE users this adds an immense features all IE users always wanted. 1st the "The Con's " 1. Seems to be too cluttered (Firefox or IE Interface is much simpler) 2. Somebody said it crashes (but not till now i have used it for three days) 3. It is 100% based on Internet Explorer, it actually extends the IE using inbuilt BHO. 4. There are two tabs which are really horrible a> Yahoo search tab (may be somebody find it useful but you can hide it) b> Similar website (This one actually is a bit cluttery one you might see you can hide this one too ) might show a set of squares as if loading something 5. I am not sure about this one but i am unable to use the Answers.com toolbar in Avant. ( may be i have to reinstall it) 6..Add your cons here...... The Pro's 1. Tabbed browsing 2. Based on IE - Works on all the websites where IE works 3. In built Google search tab 4. you don't have to import/export anything everything in IE is automatically there 5. One cick- you can hide/ close all the browsers to the system tray 6. One click all features of tabbed browsing, 7. And yes it is faster than IE 8. capable to Block "In the page " Flash or even image Ads in the page 9. Zoom in zoom out any image in the page 10. mouseover text in the page and a floating option of search etc. 11. Feeds Menu like favorite menu 12. And Ofcourse the Cool Skins.... 13..Add your pros here....... For all the IE users its bliss. Friends, Romans and all the fellow FF users please don't shoot me for using extended IE like browser, we can live side by side :) "Not everything that counts can be counted..." -Albert Einstein -- modified at 18:01 Monday 5th December, 2005
I moved from IE -> Avant Browser -> Firefox No more IE for me. If any website is not working in Firefox and I make it load that website in IE via IE tab[^] extension. The more people use Firefox it sends message to all the website administrators to support the better browser with better standards. -- modified at 22:03 Monday 5th December, 2005
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There was a bit of a bug with that. It *should* have saved when you posted a reply using it, but i've updated the code to save even more often just in case. Reload CP to refresh the code, and let me know if you run into any more problems.
----- Calvin's my hero. It used to be Shog but then I saw where he made a programming mistake and admitted it publicly. I didn't know Shog made mistakes so now he's 2nd on "The All Time Hero List" and Calvin is back at #1. - code-frog, Calling Cookie Experts...
Shog9 wrote:
but i've updated the code to save even more often just in case
:suss:
And that's not all. I just discovered this cool concept called "object oriented design". I can't wait to convert my subroutines to class methods! :-D -Ravi Bhavnani on finally installing XP SP2...in December 2005
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Quartz... wrote:
its Definitely not for FF users because its too sophisticated and a bit complicated also due to enhanced feature list
:laugh::laugh: That is rich. That's possibly the most hilarious thing I've heard in quite a while...
Quartz... wrote:
The Pro's
That list sounds exactly like everything Firefox does... :~
Do you have a specific reason for not using Firefox? Do you just dislike the Gecko engine? Are you not a big fan of standards? Maybe you just dislike Open Source Software?
And that's not all. I just discovered this cool concept called "object oriented design". I can't wait to convert my subroutines to class methods! :-D -Ravi Bhavnani on finally installing XP SP2...in December 2005