Good analysis Brit ! :-) Regardz Colin J Davies Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin More about me :-)

G. Suresh wrote: am referring to the series of books about William the rascally boy by Richmal Crompton. All this stuff about British royalty made me remember William Just thinking about William's adventures makes me laugh. Classic boy hood reading for me too. I always remember the "plays" he used to put on in his backyard. They invariably ended in some "poor helpless" female being acosted and covered in liquorice stains :-D My cousins have every single William book stacked on their shelves, along with all the Beano, Biggles, Billy Bunter etc. books/anuals. Those were good times. No worries except wondering where your next anual was coming from :) regards, Paul Watson Bluegrass Cape Town, South Africa The greatest thing you'll ever learn is just to love, and to be loved in return - Moulin Rouge

Cheers Tim. At least this pacth fixes the older stuff. Simon "The more I learn, the more I realize I don't know" - Colin Davies Sonork ID 100.10024

Great! I am looking forward to seeing it. Thanks for your kind response ;) PS: The author of BCGControlBar is also a CPian. Now I learned that you are also a CPian with a very very cool id: 126. This means that I will surely be an XTremeToolkit fan very soon :) :) Kind regards Mustafa Demirhan http://www.macroangel.com Sonork ID 100.9935:zoltrix

Joel Lucsy wrote: Why? I would think writing the app in a more "safe" way would override any pressing concerns for speed. That's the price you pay. We're not supposed to talk about the performance comparison until the release is out, but from the bitter experience we already have from thick-client apps written using Java (even JIT'ed) in the past, we still need to see how pleasant our experience will be with C#. Joel Lucsy wrote: This should be fast enough out of the starting blocks. That's not the case in reality. You can try for yourself and compare with other native C++ app written using MFC/WTL. Joel Lucsy wrote: most of the win32 api is already in the managed library. It's not only Win32 API, but also the huge C/C++ repository we've already built over the last 20+ years. Joel Lucsy wrote: Each app needs to evaluate itself on a case-by-case basis. I agree on this, just like VB is not suitable for apps that should be written using C++. // Fazlul Get RadVC today! Play RAD in VC++ http://www.capitolsoft.com

G. Suresh wrote: I am glad that Windows forms is getting the attention that it deserves. With all this hype about .NET this real neat framework for Windows Development is often ignored :confused: Colour me wrong but wasn't Windows Forms introduced with, and an integral part of, .NET ? Along with Web Forms. So when speaking about Windows Forms you are speaking .NET and have to know .NET. Right? regards, Paul Watson Bluegrass Cape Town, South Africa Do you Sonork? I do! 100.9903 Stormfront "The greatest thing you will ever learn is to love, and be loved in return" - Moulin Rouge

That would just help .NET get a better start. :) "...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001

Forget .NET - all my new projects are gonna be in WTL!

Unfortunately, there are lots of stupid programmers. That's why VB exists. Bwhaahahaahhaahaaa - now this is more like it. That's why Clipper existed. I live in Brazil, and here, I know about very few programmers using C++ correctly. Most of them, doing academic work. You're probably right, and that is one reason that C# exists, to protect monkeys from themselves. In fact, I belive that Java and C# (and it seems - god forgives me - even VB.NET) are two tools for the not-so-smart and not-so-stupid programmers. For some tasks, you just don't want to think about the best technology, performance, maintenance, OOP, clean and elegant design, and so on: haven't you made a .BAT, a .AWK or a makefile to automate something ? Actually I create shell extensions to automate things, but not so much bat files. I'm not sure the example follows through. I have some handy batch files that together saves me lots of time. Even a smarter homepage in your browser can do this. Made in VBScript. And when I do this kind of work, I you don't *have* to think about the best techonology. Well, there are some people that do this king of programming. These people do with VB and Clipper the same kind of thing that we do with batches. Not that I like it, but I think of C# and Java as midrange programming languages, where you can make quick and still elegant programming. Possibly. I'm not anti C# per se, I am anti the idea that people migrate to it holus bolus instead of seeing it as another tool with limited usefulness. About the "want to dump all the proven technologies", that's why we do not use punch cards and COBOL anymore. Nor we use DAO and RDO. The point is we dump things when something *better* comes, not something *new*. Java was supposed to kill C++ development, and now so is C#. Java remains as a useful tool for those who use it, and C# will do the same. I don't think C# will have much more success than Java, and any it does will only be because the average Sun zealot probably is less easily led than the average Microsoft flunky. FWIW we've established the person who asked the question has used C# for six months already and is just now using it at work, for an internal product. I think under those circumstances he is not behaving unwisely, an internal product gives far more control over issues that might arise, we used GDI+ in prerelease for an internal product, so I can hardly talk. ;) I am also keen to play with C#, and will probably end up followin