fat_boy wrote: Oh come on, cattle have a natrural herding instinct as do horses horses still do the mares herd with the stallion, most of the cattle breeds no longer do. They leave their children behind, they wander off by themselves, they do not defend children. It is one of the largest complaints on bringing back the wolves, with the exception of the Brahma and Longhorn breeds, the most popular breeds must be fenced to keep herded. most of their instinct has been dumbed down to the point of being effectively removed, they are effectively defenseless. They can no longer run cattle herds as they used to, you pretty much have to pack them and truck them, they simply will not run together, they will not form a "herd". However, the point of movement of any group of animals is called herding, thus herding children, herding cats, etc. Herding (movement of a group) is no longer a term only used for animals that form herds, thus any method (ask a teacher about the kids) is legal. :) _________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)